Richard Stanley
Well-Known Member
Intro Lecture, Part 1 of 4:
The following video is the first and introductory lecture of Jordan Peterson's on the psychological impact of the Bible upon Western Civilization. All of the lectures are about 2 hours long, with a Q&A session at the end. I will discuss these on this thread as I get around to watching them.
Peterson informs that he his taking us along on his search for Truth, and thankfully that he is still working all this out, these very lectures part of his process of discernment. In this first lecture, he spends a lot of time preparing the way with background context on his scientific and 'psychoanalytic' approach to the material with brief discussions on the importance of correctly understanding Nietzsche and Jung, and on the significance of dreams. As such, and with some digressions, he does not make it past the first verse of Genesis. I recommend playing it at 1.5 speed, albeit this makes him sound and appear rather manic.
Peterson discusses some of the background material of contemporary researchers that Jerry and I have in our OT series, however he comes to some different conclusions. These differences coming from that as far as I can tell he has made some prior chauvinistic assumptions about our mother Western culture and its superiority (compared to whom?). Perhaps in proceeding further we should all keep in mind the contrast between the Western 'dream' tradition of "multiplying" and "subduing the earth" (via Genesis 1:28) with that of various indigenous peoples' Dreamworlds? And that "what you see depends upon where you stand".
At about 40 minutes in he discusses that such narratives are the substrate of our common behaviors, that inform how we act in the world. Such narratives help keep the members of every respective society generally upon the same behavioral page so to speak. From my POV, it appears that Peterson is correct about this relationship, however the common underlying subtext for the Bible, both OT and NT, is to promote waves of Providential territorial conquest, until a glorious (to the victor) apocalyptic global unification is achieved. As I have also posted on this forum, the OT has 120 globalist expressions and the NT has 80 of them.
As I have discussed, the main tension (both static and dynamic) in Western Civilization, including that we are thick in the middle of now, is that between the desires and ambitions of 'Hellenizing' globalists and those 'nationalists' of the more parochial mindset. The latter dogged in maintaining the mental comforts of stasis in most everything in life, especially as they experienced life as young whelps, their perceived "good old days". And, as Peterson states, how their minds, their worldviews, were 'framed' -- with particular assistance from their respective Bible lessons.
As such, first cribbed from such as Mesopotamian and Egyptian 'dreams' the OT tells us how the first West was won, the Canaanite Promised Land, and this process was repeated in Europe and then the New World, 'typology' in real life. This aspect is in conformance with what Peterson discusses, as the pre-existing narrative informs behavior. Individual behaviors aggregated become collective social behavior, and usually the behavioral sum is synergistically more than the individual components in isolation.
In Bishop (of Los Angeles) Robert Barron's comments (below) on Peterson more generally, he notes the primacy of private property in Western Civilization and its basis in Natural Law. In fact, the West has a significant legal canon of property rights. And here, with respect to as it applies to land, I have discussed that the legal chain of titled property ownership, upon reaching back in time its genesis point, depends upon the Biblical Justification of militant Conquest. This where such as divinely anointed conquering and colonizing kings granted vast parcels of land to their favorite minions to further divvy up variously.
Without this divine justification rubric the ultimate basis of land ownership might otherwise be termed 'theft'. This rarely becomes an issue during contemporary escrow checks of your trust deed, as we all have just mentally "moved on" for generations.
Starting at 9 minutes in, Peterson mentions Nietzsche's prediction that the West's departure from the proper Dream narrative guidance would necessarily lead to the horrors of such as Hitler and Stalin. Yet, I have discussed that Nazism is a mashup of the Romantic Movement's irrational, emotion driven focus on Blood and Soil with that of adapting Christian apocalyptic and its institutional and foundational tradition of anti-Semitism (see James Carroll's Constantine's Sword for definitive proof of the latter). It doesn't help that the entire Biblical sub-narrative of the tribe of Judah appears 'synthetically' crafted as an intentional dialectic, a foil, the institutionalized Scapegoat and collective Suffering Servant.
At 1:14:00 Peterson mentions the "scapegoat" as part of the cloud of ideas presented in the dreamworld of the Bible, but does not claim in his vision quest for the Truth, that any of these ideas might be true:
Peterson mentions Christ as being both redeeming savior and 'scapegoat'. He was King of the Jews, after all, and the revealing of the ephod (the seamless robe of the high priest) of Christ in 1933 at Trier seems a clever and cryptic reveal tying the perverse messianic nature of Hitler and the Nazi cultus to its true JudeoChristian roots.
As such, I state that Hitler et al. was a cynical and contrived consequence of the exact opposite from what Peterson is claiming via such as Nietzsche. Hitler et al. also 'co-opted' the Vatican's economic 'third way', from Rerum Novarum in their bait-and-switch version of socialism. As we have also seen, Karl Marx, married into the Prussian aristocracy, had been employed to create a radical foil out of the 'democratic' socialism formed to address workers' concerns. The result was Communism, the totalitarian extreme of which became manifest in such as Stalinism. If you do not like your enemy, a threat to the existing order, create an even worse version to rally against. Thesis, Anti-thesis > Synthesis, aka Divide and Conquer.
The Nazi messiah, Adolf Hitler, justified his military offensives under the rubric of gaining lebensraum, or 'living room', for the overcrowded Germanic peoples. Of course, this begs the question of why they were overcrowded in the first place. Perhaps that Genesis command to go forth and multiply like 'JudeoChristian' [sic] bunnies?
In any case, I am now going to have to research Natural Law and see what it says about human property rights. As far as I can see, at this point, human property rights, pertaining specifically to land, is a particularly human artifice. If dominant tiger A has a territory (gained through conquest) then when once submissive tiger B becomes dominant over an aging tiger A, then the property rights change hands, via subsequent conquest.
Oh, maybe Peterson and Bishop Barron are indeed really intimating, perhaps from their subconscious interactions with their cultural memescapes, to the Natural Law -- of Conquest, as canonized in the Bible. Perhaps this conquest of land, within the parameters of Western Civilization, must have proper divine dispensation? And Hitler failed because he didn't get this particular dispensation in his Vatican Concordat?
As Postflavians, we know that Jesus is the avatar for the caesars (and likely both the intermarried Josephan Maccabees and Herodians) and subsequent vicarious popes, and we know that they had the proper dispensations for conquest, because they granted them. The land that we stand or lie upon is proof of that. Thank You Jesus.
But where will this 'process' all End? The last book of the Bible tells us, that Space Jesus will descend from the heavens, kick some serious ass, and then the whole globe will consist of ethnic nations, all answering to 'Space Jesus'. The Jesuit astronomers in Arizona, with their LUCIFER [sic] telescope are telling us the heavenly army is indeed making its preparations in the outer planets of the solar system.
Added on 1/26/19
Added on 1/30/19
The following video is the first and introductory lecture of Jordan Peterson's on the psychological impact of the Bible upon Western Civilization. All of the lectures are about 2 hours long, with a Q&A session at the end. I will discuss these on this thread as I get around to watching them.
Peterson informs that he his taking us along on his search for Truth, and thankfully that he is still working all this out, these very lectures part of his process of discernment. In this first lecture, he spends a lot of time preparing the way with background context on his scientific and 'psychoanalytic' approach to the material with brief discussions on the importance of correctly understanding Nietzsche and Jung, and on the significance of dreams. As such, and with some digressions, he does not make it past the first verse of Genesis. I recommend playing it at 1.5 speed, albeit this makes him sound and appear rather manic.
Peterson discusses some of the background material of contemporary researchers that Jerry and I have in our OT series, however he comes to some different conclusions. These differences coming from that as far as I can tell he has made some prior chauvinistic assumptions about our mother Western culture and its superiority (compared to whom?). Perhaps in proceeding further we should all keep in mind the contrast between the Western 'dream' tradition of "multiplying" and "subduing the earth" (via Genesis 1:28) with that of various indigenous peoples' Dreamworlds? And that "what you see depends upon where you stand".
At about 40 minutes in he discusses that such narratives are the substrate of our common behaviors, that inform how we act in the world. Such narratives help keep the members of every respective society generally upon the same behavioral page so to speak. From my POV, it appears that Peterson is correct about this relationship, however the common underlying subtext for the Bible, both OT and NT, is to promote waves of Providential territorial conquest, until a glorious (to the victor) apocalyptic global unification is achieved. As I have also posted on this forum, the OT has 120 globalist expressions and the NT has 80 of them.
As I have discussed, the main tension (both static and dynamic) in Western Civilization, including that we are thick in the middle of now, is that between the desires and ambitions of 'Hellenizing' globalists and those 'nationalists' of the more parochial mindset. The latter dogged in maintaining the mental comforts of stasis in most everything in life, especially as they experienced life as young whelps, their perceived "good old days". And, as Peterson states, how their minds, their worldviews, were 'framed' -- with particular assistance from their respective Bible lessons.
As such, first cribbed from such as Mesopotamian and Egyptian 'dreams' the OT tells us how the first West was won, the Canaanite Promised Land, and this process was repeated in Europe and then the New World, 'typology' in real life. This aspect is in conformance with what Peterson discusses, as the pre-existing narrative informs behavior. Individual behaviors aggregated become collective social behavior, and usually the behavioral sum is synergistically more than the individual components in isolation.
In Bishop (of Los Angeles) Robert Barron's comments (below) on Peterson more generally, he notes the primacy of private property in Western Civilization and its basis in Natural Law. In fact, the West has a significant legal canon of property rights. And here, with respect to as it applies to land, I have discussed that the legal chain of titled property ownership, upon reaching back in time its genesis point, depends upon the Biblical Justification of militant Conquest. This where such as divinely anointed conquering and colonizing kings granted vast parcels of land to their favorite minions to further divvy up variously.
Without this divine justification rubric the ultimate basis of land ownership might otherwise be termed 'theft'. This rarely becomes an issue during contemporary escrow checks of your trust deed, as we all have just mentally "moved on" for generations.
Starting at 9 minutes in, Peterson mentions Nietzsche's prediction that the West's departure from the proper Dream narrative guidance would necessarily lead to the horrors of such as Hitler and Stalin. Yet, I have discussed that Nazism is a mashup of the Romantic Movement's irrational, emotion driven focus on Blood and Soil with that of adapting Christian apocalyptic and its institutional and foundational tradition of anti-Semitism (see James Carroll's Constantine's Sword for definitive proof of the latter). It doesn't help that the entire Biblical sub-narrative of the tribe of Judah appears 'synthetically' crafted as an intentional dialectic, a foil, the institutionalized Scapegoat and collective Suffering Servant.
At 1:14:00 Peterson mentions the "scapegoat" as part of the cloud of ideas presented in the dreamworld of the Bible, but does not claim in his vision quest for the Truth, that any of these ideas might be true:
I'm not saying that any of this is true, by the way. I'm just saying what the cloud of ideas represents. @ 1:13:00
Peterson mentions Christ as being both redeeming savior and 'scapegoat'. He was King of the Jews, after all, and the revealing of the ephod (the seamless robe of the high priest) of Christ in 1933 at Trier seems a clever and cryptic reveal tying the perverse messianic nature of Hitler and the Nazi cultus to its true JudeoChristian roots.
As such, I state that Hitler et al. was a cynical and contrived consequence of the exact opposite from what Peterson is claiming via such as Nietzsche. Hitler et al. also 'co-opted' the Vatican's economic 'third way', from Rerum Novarum in their bait-and-switch version of socialism. As we have also seen, Karl Marx, married into the Prussian aristocracy, had been employed to create a radical foil out of the 'democratic' socialism formed to address workers' concerns. The result was Communism, the totalitarian extreme of which became manifest in such as Stalinism. If you do not like your enemy, a threat to the existing order, create an even worse version to rally against. Thesis, Anti-thesis > Synthesis, aka Divide and Conquer.
The Nazi messiah, Adolf Hitler, justified his military offensives under the rubric of gaining lebensraum, or 'living room', for the overcrowded Germanic peoples. Of course, this begs the question of why they were overcrowded in the first place. Perhaps that Genesis command to go forth and multiply like 'JudeoChristian' [sic] bunnies?
In any case, I am now going to have to research Natural Law and see what it says about human property rights. As far as I can see, at this point, human property rights, pertaining specifically to land, is a particularly human artifice. If dominant tiger A has a territory (gained through conquest) then when once submissive tiger B becomes dominant over an aging tiger A, then the property rights change hands, via subsequent conquest.
Oh, maybe Peterson and Bishop Barron are indeed really intimating, perhaps from their subconscious interactions with their cultural memescapes, to the Natural Law -- of Conquest, as canonized in the Bible. Perhaps this conquest of land, within the parameters of Western Civilization, must have proper divine dispensation? And Hitler failed because he didn't get this particular dispensation in his Vatican Concordat?
As Postflavians, we know that Jesus is the avatar for the caesars (and likely both the intermarried Josephan Maccabees and Herodians) and subsequent vicarious popes, and we know that they had the proper dispensations for conquest, because they granted them. The land that we stand or lie upon is proof of that. Thank You Jesus.
But where will this 'process' all End? The last book of the Bible tells us, that Space Jesus will descend from the heavens, kick some serious ass, and then the whole globe will consist of ethnic nations, all answering to 'Space Jesus'. The Jesuit astronomers in Arizona, with their LUCIFER [sic] telescope are telling us the heavenly army is indeed making its preparations in the outer planets of the solar system.
Added on 1/26/19
Added on 1/30/19
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