The Egyptian Roots of 'Freemasonry', the Inner Cult of the 'Kings'

Richard Stanley

Well-Known Member
Part 10

Samson Escapes Gaza
1Then went Samson to Gaza, and saw there an harlot, and went in unto her. 2And it was told the Gazites, saying, Samson is come hither. And they compassed him in, and laid wait for him all night in the gate of the city, and were quiet all the night, saying, In the morning, when it is day, we shall kill him. 3And Samson lay till midnight, and arose at midnight, and took the doors of the gate of the city, and the two posts, and went away with them, bar and all, and put them upon his shoulders, and carried them up to the top of an hill that is before Hebron.

Samson goes and visits a harlot in Gaza, but this is OK because his wife has been burnt to death by the Philistines. Besides he is a Nazarite, after all, having long hair like a modern day rock star, say Ted Nugent crossed with Mike Huckabee. They both like to sing Cat Scratch Fever BTW, and the latter's daughter professionally jawbones occasionally for the tweeting orangutan.

In any case, the above verses again clue us that we should not be taking the surface story literally, because the circumstances here, and to come, are ridiculous. But this also helps give us pause as to the contemporary evangelical's equation of the tweeting orangutan with Samson. It's really quite good when looking further into all the seeming nonsense behavior. Nobody can figure out what Samson is up to, whether it's the Judeans or the Philistines. Samson is a Danite ... and a Nazarite after all. This is interesting because in jumping forward to the next 'judge' episode, we find out that after hundreds of years (after the supposed Conquest) that the Danites still haven't been assigned their just due, their tribal land. For some reason they're idly hanging out along the northern coast near Zidon (today's Sidon), sitting on their thumbs.

The 'Gazites' are Philistines (of today's Gaza) and they wait for Samson "in the gate of the city". A gate in those days was a passageway through a city's or castle's thick protective wall, with strong doors at either end of the passageway, and sometimes a third interior door. Important to note: 1) The Philistines are "in the gate of the city", awaiting Samson so that they can kill him. And 2) They are awaiting him, not to capture him, but to kill him.

But Samson does not wait till morning, arising at midnight, and ... apparently very quietly ... sneaks off with the doors of the city gate, and then some; taking all this to Hebron, some distance away. Let's also remember that Samson is supposed to have already killed quite a few Philistines (1,000) with a donkey's jawbone and 30 more because of their cheating with Samson's riddle.

And now it really gets crazy:

Samson and Delilah
4And it came to pass afterward, that he loved a woman in the valley of Sorek, whose name was Delilah. 5And the lords of the Philistines came up unto her, and said unto her, Entice him, and see wherein his great strength lieth, and by what means we may prevail against him, that we may bind him to afflict him: and we will give thee every one of us eleven hundred pieces of silver. 6And Delilah said to Samson, Tell me, I pray thee, wherein thy great strength lieth, and wherewith thou mightest be bound to afflict thee. 7And Samson said unto her, If they bind me with seven green withs that were never dried, then shall I be weak, and be as another man. 8Then the lords of the Philistines brought up to her seven green withs which had not been dried, and she bound him with them. 9Now there were men lying in wait, abiding with her in the chamber. And she said unto him, The Philistines be upon thee, Samson. And he brake the withs, as a thread of tow is broken when it toucheth the fire. So his strength was not known.

10And Delilah said unto Samson, Behold, thou hast mocked me, and told me lies: now tell me, I pray thee, wherewith thou mightest be bound. 11And he said unto her, If they bind me fast with new ropes that never were occupied, then shall I be weak, and be as another man. 12Delilah therefore took new ropes, and bound him therewith, and said unto him, The Philistines be upon thee, Samson. And there were liers in wait abiding in the chamber. And he brake them from off his arms like a thread.

13And Delilah said unto Samson, Hitherto thou hast mocked me, and told me lies: tell me wherewith thou mightest be bound. And he said unto her, If thou weavest the seven locks of my head with the web. 14And she fastened it with the pin, and said unto him, The Philistines be upon thee, Samson. And he awaked out of his sleep, and went away with the pin of the beam, and with the web.

We are informed that, unlike the harlot just prior, that Samson is smitten by Delilah, and what 'straight' man hasn't been there? But as we see, Samson takes being smitten by love to an extreme, well ... except that he lies to her three times. Three times, Delilah asks Samson what his Achilles's Heel is, and three times he lies to her. In the last case, in verse 14 we learn that in apparently each instance Samson falls asleep, while there are Philistines lying in wait within Delilah's apparently well-furnished room. Each time, Delilah binds Samson per the lie, and then she awakens him by telling Samson that the Philistines "be upon thee". Thank DoGod and Dagon, the 'Sorekians' only want to afflict him, rather than killing him like the Gazites did. The ending of the Samson narrative would likely be different then. Well ... maybe.

Delilah complains each time about being mocked by Samson, but who is really being mocked here?

Let's remember the neoSamson du jour, with his strange locks, and inscrutable manner. He tells that there is a better health system offered by other advanced countries to their citizens, but we can't have it. He tells us that he is saving workers their jobs while the company at issue, Carrier, goes ahead and sends hundreds of jobs to Mexico, and he continues to hire foreign workers himself, and investigators into Ivanka's shoe factory in China go missing. Even his Philistine wife was illegal. "Goldman Sachs is evil, so I think I'll put 6 of them in the White House ... where I can keep my eye on them."

Delilah Discovers the Secret
15And she said unto him, How canst thou say, I love thee, when thine heart is not with me? thou hast mocked me these three times, and hast not told me wherein thy great strength lieth. 16And it came to pass, when she pressed him daily with her words, and urged him, so that his soul was vexed unto death; 17That he told her all his heart, and said unto her, There hath not come a rasor upon mine head; for I have been a Nazarite unto God from my mother's womb: if I be shaven, then my strength will go from me, and I shall become weak, and be like any other man.

18And when Delilah saw that he had told her all his heart, she sent and called for the lords of the Philistines, saying, Come up this once, for he hath shewed me all his heart. Then the lords of the Philistines came up unto her, and brought money in their hand. 19And she made him sleep upon her knees; and she called for a man, and she caused him to shave off the seven locks of his head; and she began to afflict him, and his strength went from him. 20And she said, The Philistines be upon thee, Samson. And he awoke out of his sleep, and said, I will go out as at other times before, and shake myself. And he wist not that the LORD was departed from him. 21But the Philistines took him, and put out his eyes, and brought him down to Gaza, and bound him with fetters of brass; and he did grind in the prison house. 22Howbeit the hair of his head began to grow again after he was shaven.

After Samson has lied to Delilah three times, and while escaping being captured by the waiting Philistines of Sorek each time, because Delilah warned the sleeping Samson, and that this story is just batshit crazy to begin with, the Philistines finally get their man. And we are told that this occurred because, finally Delilah has worn Samson down, for lying to her, even though she seems to keep Philistines lying in wait in her house.

The fourth time Samson tells her his weakness, she amazingly believes him, and so much so that she calls for the lords of the Philistines to come and they pay her the silver they promised. They pay her without the demonstration that the cutting of the locks is really the true key to his strength. Boy, are these Philistines stupid.

Is that 1,100 hundred silver pieces the total, or 1,100 pieces per Philistine lord? In any case, this very number of silver pieces just so happens to play a role in the seemingly separate, subsequent judge story of Micah and the Danites.

And how is it that the Philistine lords don't take care to keep Samson's hair trimmed? The text does not tell us if Delilah actually told them the details.

Remember the goat for the Samson denouement.

*** Well, Jerry, can you figure out the answer yet?​
 
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Richard Stanley

Well-Known Member
Is the Ja-bone also connected to the YWH-bone? As in, every bone connects to every other bone?

Samson: Illuminati Confirmed?
You are really grasping at straws, ... or pretending to. At least in the first two conjectures.

As for the last, remember my post about the tweeting orangutan and his opulent and shining golden dwelling, awash in imagery of the gods? But no ... he's just a common man who prefers KFC and McDonalds.
 

Richard Stanley

Well-Known Member
Part 9, errr 11

Samson's Vengeance and Death
23Then the lords of the Philistines gathered them together for to offer a great sacrifice unto Dagon their god, and to rejoice: for they said, Our god hath delivered Samson our enemy into our hand.
24And when the people saw him, they praised their god: for they said, Our god hath delivered into our hands our enemy, and the destroyer of our country, which slew many of us.

25And it came to pass, when their hearts were merry, that they said, Call for Samson, that he may make us sport. And they called for Samson out of the prison house; and he made them sport: and they set him between the pillars. 26And Samson said unto the lad that held him by the hand, Suffer me that I may feel the pillars whereupon the house standeth, that I may lean upon them. 27Now the house was full of men and women; and all the lords of the Philistines were there; and there were upon the roof about three thousand men and women, that beheld while Samson made sport.

28And Samson called unto the LORD, and said, O Lord GOD, remember me, I pray thee, and strengthen me, I pray thee, only this once, O God, that I may be at once avenged of the Philistines for my two eyes. 29And Samson took hold of the two middle pillars upon which the house stood, and on which it was borne up, of the one with his right hand, and of the other with his left. 30And Samson said, Let me die with the Philistines. And he bowed himself with all his might; and the house fell upon the lords, and upon all the people that were therein. So the dead which he slew at his death were more than they which he slew in his life. 31Then his brethren and all the house of his father came down, and took him, and brought him up, and buried him between Zorah and Eshtaol in the buryingplace of Manoah his father. And he judged Israel twenty years.

The lords of the Philistines are made to say that their fish-headed god, Dagon, was responsible for delivering Samson unto them, but we will never really know if this was so, or even if there was any factual basis underlying the Samson account. But, we can be sure that somebody, the story redactors, at least, were aware that human deceit was the principle element in this narrative. Both individuals deceiving others, and in other cases persons deceiving themselves. The redactors are even deceiving the 'audience' who have no eyes to see or ears to hear because the circumstances are just too inane to believe otherwise. We can be certain that many have taken the account as 'gospel' truth, as there are still many who are doing so today. At their own cost and ours.

Just as I have elsewhere shown how 9/11/2001 was part of the roll out of the coming New Age, the story of Samson seems to be part of a prior prelude to the coming new age of the monarchy of David and Solomon, at least as the canon is telling us (because there is precious little external confirmation of David's and Solomon's existence ... as presented to us). After a few more episodes of judges, a Saul will appear that ushers in the age of the kings, and about 1,000 years later another Saul will attend the last king of the Jews, and under a different name deliver the new religion to Rome, on a ship appropriately named Castor and Pollux.

On 9/11, we are told that approximately 3,000 men and women died when the Twin Towers collapsed. Among other details, I also discussed that the World Trade Center complex also had an adjacent Building 7 (aka the Salomon Brothers' Building), whose floor plan geometry even evoked the Jerusalem Temple Mount platform trapezoid.

The Philistines are not destroyed here, themselves going on to destroy Bethel / Shiloh, necessary for the new Davidic capital to emerge in Jebus, aka Jerusalem.

In any case, Samson had an agenda that he would carry out. He was groomed for this, a true Lifetime Actor. Just as the tweeting orangutan of today. This seems to make Hillary a sort of colluding Philistine Delilah.

And then there was that goat.
 
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Richard Stanley

Well-Known Member
In what sense(s) do you see the 'kid' as the equivalent of the Trojan Horse, Jerry?

Samson brought the young goat as an intended sacrificial offering, perhaps a form of 'scapegoat'. Maybe he was going to use it in some playful lecture to young Philistine school children, or maybe he did just that, and the redactors redacted what really happened similar to Bush 43 down in Florida that fateful day? As Alan Watts explained about his ultimate return to Christianity, the RCC in fact, it is that sect's 'mysterium' that attracted him, the pondering of the unknowable.
 

Jerry Russell

Administrator
Staff member
In what sense(s) do you see the 'kid' as the equivalent of the Trojan Horse, Jerry?
Samson had just murdered 30 Philistines in revenge for their having 'plowed his heifer'. So, like the Trojans vs. the Greeks, hostilities are under way. In the midst of war, Samson wants to pretend to make peace with the Philistines, by bringing this gift. It's like the Trojans bringing their horse. It looks like a peace offering, but it's really a provocation.
 

Richard Stanley

Well-Known Member
That seems plausible.

Did you take the "plowing" as a sexual connotation, whereas the surface context seems to imply merely a collusion in regards to cheating on the riddle? And supposedly they coerced her into doing so, as well.
 

Jerry Russell

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Did you take the "plowing" as a sexual connotation,
There seems to be a diversity of opinion among Hebrew scholars. The more literally minded note that the Philistines were accused of "plowing with" his heifer, which means using her as a tool to dig the dirt. The idea that the Philistines used their own tools to plow inside the heifer is not what Samson said.

Would Samson (or the OT redactors) have been devious enough to plant such a subliminal (hypnotic NLP) suggestion? As usual in such situations, I say "maybe".
 

Richard Stanley

Well-Known Member
If I say to someone that they are "fucking with me", that doesn't always imply that they are literally doing so. In fact, this expression is almost never used in a literal manner, ... right?
 
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Richard Stanley

Well-Known Member
Part 12A

OK, before moving on to the next judge, let's summarize the cogent points of the Samson narrative, and then in Part 12B [Which is out of sequence, but does exist], we'll take yet another look at the Trump comparison.

  1. The children of Israel, who had been delivered to the Promised Land by their god, the jealously violent and yet Loving Creator of the Universe, were doing evil in their new land, and thus their god puts them under the rule of yet more immigrants, the heathen and illegal alien Philistines (a tribe of the Sea Peoples resulting from the collapse of the Late Bronze Age order). Who are even more evil than the evil Israelites.
  2. Samson, the ostensible son of a Danite, and also a Nazarite - from the womb of his mother, and having had some strange 'conceptual' intervention by an 'unnamed' secretive angel (wink, wink), is raised (spoiled?) with special rules, perhaps with 'kid' gloves. It is announced that this Nazarite will 'begin to deliver' Israel from its problem Philistines. But he doesn't actually deliver Israel but rather instigates animosities that result in the destruction of the temple at Bethel / Shiloh and ultimately result in the Davidic kingship, the New Order du jour. The Nazarite aspect implies a royal personage, and not from the lowly, immigrant (also Sea Peoples) Danites. After several hundred years from the Conquest, the Danites aren't even settled by the time of Samson, although the Bible account has the Danites originally being settled in the south and thus displaced by the Philistines. There are no royals in Israel, as the very topic of the Book of Judges is about the period of no kings, in the post-Conquest period. The NZR is from the Egyptian context meaning princely royalty. His royalty really stems from the implication of divine (actually royal) involvement in his mother's pregnancy.
  3. The now grown up Samson decides he must have a wife from amongst the uncircumcised Philistines, and orders his parents to arrange this. But he has a hidden agenda, in a desire to "seek an occasion against" the Philistines.
  4. Samson oddly kills a young lion with his bare hands and later finds its carcass filled with bees and honey. The lion symbolizes the tribe of Judah, and the bees and honey again represent royalty. Samson will later employ the Judeans to deliver him up to the Philistines, just as Jesus the Nazarene is delivered up by the Jews (Judeans) to the Romans. Thus the tribe of Judah, likely the original Canaanite occupants of this southern region are taken over by the external royalty implanted by the neighboring Egyptians. Samson does not tell his parents about 'renting' the lion "as if he would rent a kid" (for example, for the sacrifice of a scapegoat). This is a Big Secret indeed (not just for then, but for understanding the underlying Western power structure today, albeit having a different political 'appearance').
  5. For the purposes of "seeking the occasion against", Samson creates a riddle for the Philistines. A riddle which is otherwise unsolvable, because he really knows in advance that his wife will be enlisted to get the answer from him, otherwise there is no cheating pretext for 'the occasion'. The Philistines, so anxious not to lose and to win the reward for solving the riddle, they threaten Samson's new wife and father-in-law with burning down their house. Samson provides the answer to his wife, again, knowing that this is the only way that the Philistines will get the correct answer. Once they provide the answer he now has a pretext for his 'occasion against' them. He kills thirty other (presumably innocent bystanders) Philistines and took their spoils while honoring his conditions by giving those who answered the riddle correctly the promised reward. It's nice to know that there is honor in this world.
  6. Samson, understanding the displeasure that he has done to the Philistines, by his 'occasion' grants himself the relative moral high ground.
  7. But he is not done by simply killing 30 Philistines, for he will destroy all their harvest crops with fire, via lighting foxes' tails on fire. This causes the Philistines to burn Samson's Philistine wife and father-in-law to death, but Samson was only using them to further his hidden agenda. However, this gives him more grist for the 'occasion'. He avenges himself by killing all those who burnt his wife and her father. Then he retires to the top of a big rock in Judea. This is like the Mount of Olives and the Garden of Gethsemane for Jesus.
  8. The unhappy Philistines come to Judea looking to capture Samson, but the Judeans, always perfidious (even in their own holy books), decide to curry favor with the Philistines and capture Samson, their 'deliverer' for the Philistines. Someone should have told Samson this was going to happen.
  9. After the Judeans bring the bound Samson "up" from the top of a big rock, they deliver him to the Philistines. But the Spirit of the Lord comes upon Samson and he gets loose, finds a donkey's jawbone and kills 1,000 Philistines with it. Then the jawbone, with God's help, provides him with some water to slake his thirst.
  10. Samson, who can't get enough action from the Philistines, visits Gaza and takes up with a harlot there. The Philistines wait for him inside the city gate, thinking he will arrive there at dawn. But Samson rises at midnight and takes the gate all the way to just outside Hebron. In other words, while the guards are sleeping, the stone in front of Jesus's tomb has been moved.
  11. Samson is now in love, again, with, you guessed it, another Philistine woman - named Delilah.
  12. Those Philistines find out, and their lords come and offer here 1100 pieces of silver (or multiples of this) if she will find out how they may safely capture him. The better to afflict him with, ... rather than killing him outright.
  13. She tries three times, and each time Samson lies to her, and each time there are Philistines lying in wait to capture (and not kill) him, but nobody seems to catch on that something is rotten in Denmark.
  14. Finally, on the fourth try he tells her, and before this method is tested, the Philistine lords pay Delilah her reward. But, .... it works, and they capture Samson. This is incredible. Somebody is being mocked here, according to Delilah, at least. Who could it be?
  15. Samson was captured because his Nazarite (royal) hair was cut, but the Philistines, somehow, neglect to keep Samson's hair from growing back.
  16. Samson destroys the Philistine temple, with 'about 3,000' dancing Philistines on its roof, by toppling two columns. In doing so he, the Nazarite 'savior', sacrifices himself. Only he doesn't save the Israelites, as we found out subsequently that the Philistines later go on to destroy the Israelite temple at Bethel (Shiloh). The outfall will be that a Saul appears on the scene and finally, a new age of the kingship appears. Who writes this stuff?
Revised 6/17/17
 
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Jerry Russell

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If I say to someone that they are "fucking with me", that doesn't always imply that they are literally doing so. In fact, this expression is almost never used in a literal manner, ... right?
Wouldn't this depend on the personal attributes of both the subject and object of the phrase? That is, if one heterosexual white male blogger is complaining about another, it's probably metaphorical. Or at any rate, the readers certainly hope so. Whereas, if someone is making an accusation about the captain of the high school football team with respect to his teenage daughter, the interpretation would be different. When it comes to ancient Hebrew, I wonder if there is even one more example of the use of the word "plowing" in this context, to judge the statistics? My answer is "maybe" and I'm sticking to it.

Who writes this stuff?
Another question is, who actually reads it? There are many commentaries and exegeses of these OT chapters on the Internet, and yet nobody seems to notice or question how strange it all is. Your interpretation "The lion symbolizes the tribe of Judah, and the bees and honey again represent royalty" seems very reasonable, but many commentators see it as a simple demonstration of strength on Samson's part. Others agree that the Lion is Judah, but say that the bees & honey are the tribe of Dan, and as such, they see the story as a prophecy of the rise of Merovingians?

In general, authors write for their intended audience. If we can figure out who could read & understand the message, maybe that would be a clue as to who would have written?
 
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Jerry Russell

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Under Barbiero's schema, which generally appears very reasonable to me, with a few exceptions, the entire Euro-royalty is made up of whom Barbiero terms the 'priestly descendants of Moses', including Josephus's Hasmonian kin, who frequently cryptically reveal themselves to fellow insiders by appending variants of 'Flavi' to their names, whether they are officiants of the Christian Church, the mystery cult of Mithra, the secular imperium, or later institutions. This especially includes the Carolingian Dynasty (aka the Holy Roman Empire), founded by Charlemagne, that superceded that of the curious Merovingian Dynasty.
At least in the sense of strict male patriarchal bloodlines, as tested by Y-DNA haplotypes, we can actually rule out this theory. As Barbiero discusses in this book, we do know that the Kohanim, those Jews who traditionally consider themselves to be the patriarchal descendents of Aaron, actually do have a significant degree of genetic commonality. about 75% of the Kohanim are in the J haplogroup, which generally is associated with Semitic ancestry. More interestingly, this 2008 study found that it is possible to define an "extended Cohanen Modal Haplotype" within the J-P58* sub-clade of the J haplogroup, and that 46.1% of their sample of Kohanim fall within this modal haplotype. These individuals have a very small but measurable amount of genetic diversity, with an estimated divergence time of 3,000 years (give or take 1,000). This represents, basically, a single patriarchal lineage. Another 14.4% of the Kohanim represented a second distinct lineage in the J-M410* sub-clade, and three other distinct lineages were identified with similar divergence times.

The most likely explanation for this is not that the Kohanim descended from a single person (such as Moses or Aaron), nor from a small group of five priests all living at the same time. It's more probable that there was a relatively small original "meta-population" of perhaps a few hundred priests of Semitic ancestry, living within several semi-isolated communities maintaining a group of priests in each community. Owing to genetic drift, most of the haplotypes represented in the original founding group have disappeared over time, leaving greatly reduced and very distinctive genetic diversity.

A contrasting situation has been identified with descendants of Genghis Kahn. Some 16 million men can be shown to share a Y-chromosome modal haplotype (within haplogroup C*) which can be traced to Mongolia, with a divergence time of ~1000 years. The marker is also shared by those Hazaras of Pakistan whose oral genealogies trace directly to the famous conquerer. The authors of the linked paper plausibly argue that Genghis Kahn and his descendants have been sufficiently fruitful, reproductively speaking, to justify such numbers.

As for the Euro-Royalty, we can definitively say that they are not part of either the Kohanim lineage or Genghis Khan's lineage. As discussed at this article by Lee Rimmer, the royal houses of Stuart, Saxe-Coburg Gotha, Mountbatten-Windsor, the kings of Denmark, and the Bourbon Kings of France, are all in the R1b haplogroup. This same haplogroup represents 80% of all male lineages in Western Europe. Within this general haplogroup, I don't know how many distinctive and specific royal "modal haplotypes" can be traced.

The Rothschilds are J2-M172, which is a plausibly Jewish haplogroup, but not within any of the Cohen modal haplotypes, nor any European royal categories.

As to the admixture between Jewish and gentile royal families as required by our SSSM or "grafting" theories, all is not lost. The key is that such couplings would generally involve a male Euro-royal coupled with a female Jew. Such a coupling would leave no trace in Y-DNA haplotypes, but would be immediately obvious in an mt-DNA test or an autosomal test.
 

Richard Stanley

Well-Known Member
Thanks Jerry.

First, I'd like to assert that Barbiero's major point, in my mind, does not preclude that the Hasmonean family might have rather different genetic origins than what is typically allowed for in the traditional context of 'Jewish Kohanim'. And, as Barbiero discusses, there was some interesting literary machinations involved in conflating the descendants of 'Moses' with that of Aaron. Then we have a similar 'grafting' take place, I believe, in the story of Samson - in regards to the killing of the lion and the resulting bees and honey. And this 'grafting' concept is central to the foundation of Christianity in the grafting of the wild and domestic olive trees in Roman 11.

And as I've mentioned before, we have to deal with the fact that the term, cohen, is generic Semitic for 'priest, and as such would have been used by the Phoenicians, and is found today within the Arab community. And speaking of Genghis Khan, I've seen it argued that 'Kahn' is indeed etymologically related to 'cohen'. Semites have had quite a large geographical spread, some (the Diffusionists, like myself) argue globally, such that the Hawaiian kahuna priests were shamanic 'cohens'.

Interesting in that both Barbiero and Paul Fitzgerald are pushing variants of the Norman involvement as being critical to understand. DeVere claimed this as well, only with even more granularity, and ironically that not only were his elite Normans the real players of the biblical Palestine, but that they were the real and only 'Arya'. If such as DeVere is correct, then this makes the genetic tracing issue more complex, at least, in coming to an understanding of what we must look for as the definitive gene lines. As we discussed, DeVere claims to know.

And, all this is consistent with my conclusions that the Bible is telling us that there is a lot of elite identity theft occurring buried in the subtexts of the various stories.

I'm still not quite understanding any genetic overlap, or lack thereof, between the later Kohanim studies and the first ones that Barbiero discussed. With these, he discusses a geographical distribution of the respective genes that remarkably correlate to the various geographical origins of the Roman emperors.
 

Jerry Russell

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The earlier studies showed that the Kohanim generally fell into the J haplogroup. These haplogroups are based on SNP markers. The latest "CMH" modal signature is based on many more genetic markers (including Y-DNA STR's), and is much more specific than any of the general haplogroups.

In Barbiero's book, he used the nomenclature that the Kohanim are in the EU9 and EU10 groups. This seems to be an old-fashioned way of designating the J haplogroup (umbrella of J* and all its sub-clades). However, the geographic distribution of J doesn't look much like Barbiero said. From Wikipedia, here's the current thinking:



The distribution of the J2 subclade (aka J-M172) shows a little more density in Pannonia and a strong showing in Constantinople, but the later studies don't show many of the Kohanim in J2. The Rothschilds are J2.


 
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Richard Stanley

Well-Known Member
What was fascinating to me about the so-called EU10 group was that it seems to date much later than the others.

What is the link for the map above, Jerry? This seems to provide some credence to the Diffusionist view of the early wide distribution of 'Semitic' cultures.
 

Jerry Russell

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Staff member
What was fascinating to me about the so-called EU10 group was that it seems to date much later than the others.
Barbiero was quoting Sykes making that argument for what he called the "Jasmine" mtDNA haplogroup. This group is aka the J haplogroup, which is coincidentally the same letter for the Y-DNA haplogroup J (otherwise known as EU9 and EU10). The letters assigned to the Y haplogroups are completely independent from the letters assigned to the mtDNA haplogroups -- I believe the items in both sequences were assigned by order of discovery.

I can't find any recent source that agrees with Sykes that the J haplogroup diverged relatively recently. Wiki says the mutation defining J occurred ~45,000 years ago. Sykes says the map of J is patchy, but it looks as smooth as any of them to me.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Haplogroup_J_(mtDNA)#/media/File:Frequency_maps_based_on_HVS-I_data_for_haplogroups_J.png



What is the link for the map above, Jerry?
The first map, of Y-DNA haplogroup J, is from: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Haplogroup_J_(Y-DNA)#/media/File:Haplogroup_J_(Y-DNA).svg

The second, of Y-DNA haplogroup J2, is from http://www.eupedia.com/europe/Haplogroup_J2_Y-DNA.shtml

And here's another map of haplogroup J2, showing a broader area including the distribution in Arabia and Asia. The image looks very similar to the other map where the coverage areas overlap -- but not exactly the same. Could be different data, or a different color interpolation routine.

https://commons.wikimedia.org/wiki/File:J2-Y-DNA-Haplogroup-Map-J2-M172-Map-J2-Haplogrubu-Haritasi-v3.png

 

Richard Stanley

Well-Known Member
It's interesting to note the combined high concentrations coming from the Caucasus and from down in Saudi Arabia / Yemen. This region extends from modern day Riyadh down to the ancient Sabean kingdom reputed for the Queen of Sheba. Also the smaller region around the Gulf of Aqaba, reputed to be where Moses and the Hebrews confronted the Amalakites. There is also Sudan, where the Sabbah brothers assert the Yahud were the priests of Amenhotep III.

Thus, we have genetic evidence of priestly families, as Barbiero would say, in the areas pointed to by both the Sabbah brothers and Ezzat, excluding the Caucasus. But the Caucasus in the general region of ancient Urartu, and Urfa / Harran.
 

Jerry Russell

Administrator
Staff member
Thus, we have genetic evidence of priestly families, as Barbiero would say
To complete the analysis, it would also help to show that a significant percentage of those J-haplogroup individuals also are included in the "extended modal haplotype" as described by the Hammer et al. 2008 paper. Otherwise, there could be some other / more ancient cause of this odd distribution pattern. But, at least the distribution of the Y-DNA haplogroup J is consistent with the idea that these priestly families were the founder group for those populations shown in the graphic.
 

Richard Stanley

Well-Known Member
Part 13

From Judges 17 KJV:

Micah's Idolatry

1And there was a man of mount Ephraim, whose name was Micah. 2And he said unto his mother, The eleven hundred shekels of silver that were taken from thee, about which thou cursedst, and spakest of also in mine ears, behold, the silver is with me; I took it. And his mother said, Blessed be thou of the LORD, my son. 3And when he had restored the eleven hundred shekels of silver to his mother, his mother said, I had wholly dedicated the silver unto the LORD from my hand for my son, to make a graven image and a molten image: now therefore I will restore it unto thee. 4Yet he restored the money unto his mother; and his mother took two hundred shekels of silver, and gave them to the founder, who made thereof a graven image and a molten image: and they were in the house of Micah. 5And the man Micah had an house of gods, and made an ephod, and teraphim, and consecrated one of his sons, who became his priest. 6In those days there was no king in Israel, but every man did that which was right in his own eyes.

Immediately following the Samson narrative comes the odd story of Micah, a man of Mount Ephraim. As previously discussed, the surrounding territory of which contains Shiloh / Bethel, the latter meaning the House of El, and the capital of Israel prior to Jerusalem according to the biblical narrative. And, importantly El was also the heavenly father god of the Canaanite pantheon, to be merged with Yahweh in the OT corpus.

First, we must note the business of the 1,100 shekels of silver that the unnamed mother of Micah has been upset about. Could this possibly be the 1,100 pieces of silver paid to Delilah by the Philistine lords for enabling the capture of Samson? Or is this just a coincidence? If it is the same chunk of change, then must we also conclude that the mother is Delilah as well and thus a Philistine woman? The woman and Micah are not normative followers of the Mosaic law, at least, as Micah has a "house of gods" and made an ephod and a teraphim. Verse 6 gives a frequent refrain found in the various Judges' narratives that there was no king in Israel and that, presumably as a consequence, every man did what was right in his own eyes. Thus we have a confusingly Trumpesque situation, left to wonder what is the actual circumstances being presented to us as relates to Micah being a 'Hebrew' ... or what? Is the 'actor' Trump a populist, a faux populist, a corporate 'liberal', ... or what?

In the time of Jesus, we come to learn that an ephod is the seamless robe of a Jewish high priest, and yet today the Roman Catholic Church claims to possess Jesus's high priest ephod in the cathedral of Trier, Germany, the favorite city of Constantine's. It is only rarely paraded out for viewing, the last two times in bookending WWII. The first of these in 1933 celebrating Adolf Hitler's election to power, and the last in 1959. Both sacred ceremonies of which were attended by Fritz von Papen, a German politician and official of Hitler's who negotiated the Nazi Concordat with the Vatican, later to become a papal chamberlain. How fitting is this? Truly the Lord works in mysterious ways.

This interpretation of what an ephod is seems consonant with Micah being able to consecrate one of his sons as his priest, especially given that the narratives are almost always discussing elite individuals in reality. However, the various bible commentaries seem to be confused as to what exactly this ephod is and what it actually represents. In any case, the 'teraphim' and the mention of numerous house gods
demonstrates that either Micah is a 'backslider' from the Mosaic system or merely evidence that we are in the transitional phase of conversion, whether or not these Judge narratives have any chronological or other reality to them.

7And there was a young man out of Bethlehemjudah of the family of Judah, who was a Levite, and he sojourned there. 8And the man departed out of the city from Bethlehemjudah to sojourn where he could find a place: and he came to mount Ephraim to the house of Micah, as he journeyed. 9And Micah said unto him, Whence comest thou? And he said unto him, I am a Levite of Bethlehemjudah, and I go to sojourn where I may find a place. 10And Micah said unto him, Dwell with me, and be unto me a father and a priest, and I will give thee ten shekels of silver by the year, and a suit of apparel, and thy victuals. So the Levite went in. 11And the Levite was content to dwell with the man; and the young man was unto him as one of his sons. 12And Micah consecrated the Levite; and the young man became his priest, and was in the house of Micah. 13Then said Micah, Now know I that the LORD will do me good, seeing I have a Levite to my priest.

What has been lost here is what happens to the son of Micah who was made a priest, and then within the narrative is immediately overtaken by the Levite. We never hear about the priestly son again, as the story proceeds on with what happens to the Levite, whose origins are from Bethlehem. We are also directly confronted with that this unnamed Levite is also of the family of Judah. Within contemporary Judaic norms, there is little distinction made between Levites and Jews. However, within the canonic accounts and in those earlier times we were told that the Levites were given absolute control over the 48 largest cities of Israel (including Judea). Certainly, we might expect that intermarriage between tribes occurred, especially given that Judah was granted a 'ruling' status, at least in a secular sense, as opposed to the Levites' spiritual domain.

And interesting that so much is made out of that this priest is a Levite and of Judah, yet we cannot know his name, like several other characters sprinkled through the OT. The very next Judge narrative will feature an unnamed Levite that triggers the ethnic cleansing of the Benjamites. Soon we will be upon the Book of Ruth, the Moabite great-grandmother of King David, where her name is seemingly named in a capricious fashion by comparison. Importantly, within our new lens of interpretation, the Moabites (from Lot) and Edomites (from Esau), as tribal identities, are all still part of one elite familial construct, albeit quarrelsome, and thus we find such characters otherwise oddly entering the Biblical narratives and history (e.g. such as the Edomite Herodians). But per the contemporary social paradigm we have been raised in, we are 'framed' to ignore such gross intermingling within the so-called OT Hebraic narrative.

But now the Micah story pivots to the Danites:
 
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Richard Stanley

Well-Known Member
Part 14

From Judges 18 KJV:

The Danites Settle in Laish

1In those days there was no king in Israel: and in those days the tribe of the Danites sought them an inheritance to dwell in; for unto that day all their inheritance had not fallen unto them among the tribes of Israel. 2And the children of Dan sent of their family five men from their coasts, men of valour, from Zorah, and from Eshtaol, to spy out the land, and to search it; and they said unto them, Go, search the land: who when they came to mount Ephraim, to the house of Micah, they lodged there. 3When they were by the house of Micah, they knew the voice of the young man the Levite: and they turned in thither, and said unto him, Who brought thee hither? and what makest thou in this place? and what hast thou here? 4And he said unto them, Thus and thus dealeth Micah with me, and hath hired me, and I am his priest. 5And they said unto him, Ask counsel, we pray thee, of God, that we may know whether our way which we go shall be prosperous. 6And the priest said unto them, Go in peace: before the LORD is your way wherein ye go.

Several hundreds of years after the Conquest, the Danites have yet to be settled in a land of their own, despite that the other tribes had been assigned their lands in a big council held at Shiloh / Bethel. How odd, in fact, the Danites are going out to scout land for their 'inheritance' even amongst their fellow Hebrew cousins. How odd? One might think that maybe the Danites had been assigned their territory, but that the Hebrew confederation had not gotten around to helping seize it for their Danite kin. Which begs questions in and of itself.

And then we are told that these spies knew the voice of the young Levite priest, the priest whose name we don't get to learn. This tells that there was a pre-existing relationship of some sort and that the young priest was memorable enough for the Danite spies to have remembered his voice.

7Then the five men departed, and came to Laish, and saw the people that were therein, how they dwelt careless, after the manner of the Zidonians, quiet and secure; and there was no magistrate in the land, that might put them to shame in any thing; and they were far from the Zidonians, and had no business with any man. 8And they came unto their brethren to Zorah and Eshtaol: and their brethren said unto them, What say ye? 9And they said, Arise, that we may go up against them: for we have seen the land, and, behold, it is very good: and are ye still? be not slothful to go, and to enter to possess the land. 10When ye go, ye shall come unto a people secure, and to a large land: for God hath given it into your hands; a place where there is no want of any thing that is in the earth.

11And there went from thence of the family of the Danites, out of Zorah and out of Eshtaol, six hundred men appointed with weapons of war. 12And they went up, and pitched in Kirjathjearim, in Judah: wherefore they called that place Mahanehdan unto this day: behold, it is behind Kirjathjearim. 13And they passed thence unto mount Ephraim, and came unto the house of Micah.​

The five spies espy the desired land, in the north around present day Sidon. The people living there are secure and quiet, therefore careless in their defense against conquistadors. And so 'God', via the Danites proximity to Shiloh / Bethel, take this land as their inheritance. The Danites had been pitching camp in Judea, and along the way to their new land stopped in Ephraim at Micah's house. Here, they will gain themselves a Levite, the young priest of Micah's as their new high priest. So, in addition to having been made to wander in the wilderness for centuries beyond that of the other tribes, if we are to believe this account, they also went without a Levitical priest during that period. How odd, again. Let's remember that we now know that the Danites were not Hebrews to begin with, albeit they seem to likely have had Egyptian origins with a stop in Greece first.

Danites Take Micah's Idols

14Then answered the five men that went to spy out the country of Laish, and said unto their brethren, Do ye know that there is in these houses an ephod, and teraphim, and a graven image, and a molten image? now therefore consider what ye have to do. 15And they turned thitherward, and came to the house of the young man the Levite, even unto the house of Micah, and saluted him. 16And the six hundred men appointed with their weapons of war, which were of the children of Dan, stood by the entering of the gate. 17And the five men that went to spy out the land went up, and came in thither, and took the graven image, and the ephod, and the teraphim, and the molten image: and the priest stood in the entering of the gate with the six hundred men that were appointed with weapons of war. 18And these went into Micah's house, and fetched the carved image, the ephod, and the teraphim, and the molten image. Then said the priest unto them, What do ye? 19And they said unto him, Hold thy peace, lay thine hand upon thy mouth, and go with us, and be to us a father and a priest: is it better for thee to be a priest unto the house of one man, or that thou be a priest unto a tribe and a family in Israel? 20And the priest's heart was glad, and he took the ephod, and the teraphim, and the graven image, and went in the midst of the people.

21So they turned and departed, and put the little ones and the cattle and the carriage before them. 22And when they were a good way from the house of Micah, the men that were in the houses near to Micah's house were gathered together, and overtook the children of Dan. 23And they cried unto the children of Dan. And they turned their faces, and said unto Micah, What aileth thee, that thou comest with such a company? 24And he said, Ye have taken away my gods which I made, and the priest, and ye are gone away: and what have I more? and what is this that ye say unto me, What aileth thee? 25And the children of Dan said unto him, Let not thy voice be heard among us, lest angry fellows run upon thee, and thou lose thy life, with the lives of thy household. 26And the children of Dan went their way: and when Micah saw that they were too strong for him, he turned and went back unto his house.

27And they took the things which Micah had made, and the priest which he had, and came unto Laish, unto a people that were at quiet and secure: and they smote them with the edge of the sword, and burnt the city with fire. 28And there was no deliverer, because it was far from Zidon, and they had no business with any man; and it was in the valley that lieth by Bethrehob. And they built a city, and dwelt therein. 29And they called the name of the city Dan, after the name of Dan their father, who was born unto Israel: howbeit the name of the city was Laish at the first. 30And the children of Dan set up the graven image: and Jonathan, the son of Gershom, the son of Manasseh, he and his sons were priests to the tribe of Dan until the day of the captivity of the land. 31And they set them up Micah's graven image, which he made, all the time that the house of God was in Shiloh.

The Levite priest ends up going off with the Danites to their new land, where he will become not only their high priest but their 'father'. And despite literally being of Moses, he allows the pagan aspects to be transferred from Micah to the Danites, and also condones their slaughter of the natives of Laish. And, we have yet another familial confusion with the sons of Manasseh becoming the priests of Dan. What happened to the Levitical Judean?

A temple will also be set up for the Danites, which must later be dealt with as being in competition with the coming one in Jerusalem.
 
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