Part 1, the Futurist Apocalypse is Now

Discussion in 'Apocalypse How series' started by Richard Stanley, Jan 31, 2017.

  1. Richard Stanley

    Richard Stanley Administrator

    Yes!!! Written by The Flavian team headed by Josephus Flavius. Josephus and Paul both used Epiphroditus, Nero's slave to publish and such.

    Also, I forgot to mention that the 9/23/2017 alignment in Virgo (Revelation 12:1,2) definitively cements that the Futurist script is underway, and from the timing that Trump is the scripted Beast of the Sea. Either one ridiculously believes this is supernatural or that the Sabeans (star watchers, Magi, Sabines, etc.) who created all this nonsense understood the celestial timing from way back then. I have already debunked the debunking of the alignment. This is a highly specific, and unique alignment to 2017.

    The Antikythera Mechanism proves that such people had the ability to make such predictions.
  2. No doubt they did, but I distrust hyped "prophecies" such as this. no matter how much I believe in the supernatural, they are either heralds of some type of manufactured event or a non-event meant to deligitimize/distort real prophecy. We can certainly agree that "something's up" since 9/23 has been buried in as much predictive programming as 9-11, and the last time 9-23 was hyped was in 2015, followed by the geopolitical sea change to a new cold war catalyzed by Syria...I don't doubt Iran is on tbe table next.

    But you agree there is no change in the NT from the first century to the council of Nicea (irrespective of authorship!)? I am arguing (as does Jay Dyer that this is evidence of traditions and writings handed down by the Apostles, with little deviation unless you count Origen. This mainly disproves Pagels, et al in their claim that the Gnostic writings are "the real Christianity". That is wrong even if you are right.

    At least in Preterism, the sea beast and the beast from the abyss are identical, both are Rome, Nero being the "one head that is", the preceding Julio-Claudians the "five (that) are fallen", and the one to come and rule for a short space is Galma. When the Flavians "resurrected" the empire from tbe "underworld", this is the Roman beast returning from the abyss. Then again it is said the beast will continue till it "goes to perdition" and we both agree Roman power continues to this day. So it is at least remotely possible your beast from the sea and messiah from the abyss are part of the same entity, even with Preterism.
  3. Richard Stanley

    Richard Stanley Administrator

    As I have discussed on the forum, I looked at the alignment using Stellarium, a free program. It is very, very well aligned with the wording of Rev 12, including even that Jupiter, the new savior, after passing Leo and its Regulus, spends about 9 months inside of Virgo's pregnant belly (because of two retrograde motions). The odds of this are .... astronomical, and it fits within the repeating millennial construct of Revelation.

    Pagels and Gnosticism is a completely separate claim. There is much written about how the gospel texts have been tweaked. The last one I saw was John Bartram showing how the 'E' in CHREST had been clearly modified into an 'I" for Christ, within the Codex Sinaiticus. Bartram's work focuses on showing that the Flavians and friends were secret Chrestians, based upon widespread epigraphy.

    And besides, as I said before, all these mainsteam canonic texts passed through the provenance of Rome. One then also has to deal with the fact that the canonic gospels are interwoven with Josephus' works (as shown by Atwill), where they each answer cryptic elements in the other. We have mentioned recent books on the forum that analyze both Paul's and Jesus' messaging and how they all fit Rome's agenda.

    Agreed. Everything depends upon perspective.
  4. I agree the alignment matches the text, I just distrust the hype is of course distrust the text.

    The trouble with the Flavian hypothesis is that if the Gospels/NT are bona fide, then Josephus and Tacitus would *match them anyway*. If John had a vision of the glorified Christ in A.D. 65 Who showed him "things which must shortly come to pass", then they did, from 66-70, and historians recorded it. If not, it was written later as a forged prophecy. If Jesus' kingdom is spiritual and eternal and egalitarian, then one is beating a dead horse by worrying about temporal government, and the agenda of the racist supremacist xenophobes who hate and want to replace Rome is simply NOT being served, making it seem like Rome's agenda *is* by default; if it's a convoluted Roman plot, then Rome not the Jews is being served. Is the glass half empty or half full? Do the letters spell out "God is nowhere" or "God is now here"?

    You can't simply do what, say, the Jesus Seminar does, regarding (for example) the resurrection narrative: "it must be figurative because people don't rise from the dead". Personal incredulity fallacy, the supernatural "can't be", so there MUST be another explanation, no matter how convoluted and bizzare, or how reality must be contorted to make it fit. If a supernatural-shaped hole is present, fill it with the supernatural; if it doesn't fit, you must acquit. (Of course I have not examined ALL of the evidence presented/invoked for the hypothesis in question here, it may fit reality despite my whopping misgivings.)
  5. Richard Stanley

    Richard Stanley Administrator

    Is it disappointing that the Futurist Revelation boils down to the mundane tick, tock of celestial solar system mechanics?

    But beyond the Preterist Second Coming they don't do they? Jesus said the temple would be destroyed in the generation of his disciples, meaning 40 years. The temple was indeed destroyed, but where was Jesus? When General Josephus is tromping around Galilee, accused of being in cahoots with the Romans, his ass gets saved by one of the Jesus's he writes about. Josephus also later records a friend - Jesus (maybe the same one?) being crucified between two others.

    The Josephus and his large family go off to Rome with the Flavians, having given the Flavians the Temple treasury. Then a bunch of Flavians are involved in the early Roman Church.

    Oops, I forgot. The strength of the argument made in Caesar's Messiah is that the canonic Gospels and Josephus are essentially in dialogue with each other. They each answer cryptic aspects raised by the other, in their respective serial narrative sequences. This is impossible if they were written separately.

    Have you read Atwill's CM?

    Cui bono? I've got some swamp land in Jupiter, Florida to sell you. Right next to Mar a Lago (Sea and Lake).

    It is quite likely that the Nazoreans (Hebrew speaking Zealots) and the Christiani (Greek speaking Jewish Zealots) were indeed egalitarian, and thus a bad economic vibe for the aristocratic Romans and elite Jews, Herodians (Edomites - from that red-headed Esau). Today, 'egalitarian' is code for collectivist scum by the crypto-Catholic right and their poodles. Nothing changes.

    When the prior new order arrived after the destruction of the 'egalitarian' rebel, the Elect from before (the Old Boss) gave birth to the new Elect (the New Boss) as if it was Predestined. "Meet the New Boss, same as the Old Boss." This is how it will work in the present revelation.

    If the so-called Preterist End Times was a one off event, then pray tell why is there the explicit reference to 24 1,000 year periods? An allusion to the zodiacal Great Year, rounded down of course.
    Last edited: Oct 24, 2017
  6. There were as many Jesuses running around ancient Galilee as there are around modern East L.A., you couldn't piss into tbe wind without dousing five of tbem. "Christ" is just Greek for Messiah, not the NT Jesus per se. All kinds of Messianics running about then too.

    And Atwill has a colorful imagination. Again, if we hypothesize preterism, the Flavians are antiChrist figures, and a good case can be made for Josephus as the second beast coming out of the land (meaning the Holy Land) who speaks as the serpent to deceive people into worshipping the first beast (Vespasian) and its Image (Titus). If he weaves pseudo-Gospeliciousnesss into his narrative, after reading them, that's par for the course. In short the Romans are like pornographers, they didn't invent the thing from which they profit, but they make it into a perversity to be sold for their beneifit: "cui boner" is a better question.

    As for the preterist apocalypse being a one off: if it is the only "Elect" are presently united "in the air" (next echelon of reality) with the returned Lord, and comprise the "City of God" whose gates are open so that anyone can enter and drink of tbe water of life freely. Among those who *won't* (or perhaps shan't) go in are "whosever loveth and maketh a lie" such as Roman Catholicism or Protest-ant Futurism. There is no earthly "elect" to be the new boss/divine proxy; the emperor has no clothes and no crown either. If you want to join them, you will have to "die and go to heaven", building earthly religiopolitical structures won't help. Better to render unto Caesar and enter the kingdom of God than to mistake tbe kingdom of Caesar for that of God.

    As well it is the Latin Vulgate which says "millennium", the Greek term implies "thousands of years"--perhaps 24 of them? But in any event it is a numerical metaphor like 144,000 and 666, and you are the only one I have known to suggest the #24.
  7. Richard Stanley

    Richard Stanley Administrator

    2And immediately I was in the spirit: and, behold, a throne was set in heaven, and one sat on the throne. 3And he that sat was to look upon like a jasper and a sardine stone: and there was a rainbow round about the throne, in sight like unto an emerald. 4And round about the throne were four and twenty seats: and upon the seats I saw four and twenty elders sitting, clothed in white raiment; and they had on their heads crowns of gold. (Revelation 4 KJV)

    It is all metaphor, and this is a clear allusion to 24 periods of 1,000 years, the Great Year. Your god is the Sun, derived from all the major pagan religions. Deal with it, or continue to deny it. And apparently your god is gay as well.

    Jesus entered "through the Golden Gate", and this is yet another cosmological allusion to the very same solar system and its alignments. Yet you are too deep in fundamentalist self-referential denial, which the Predestined Elect wants you to be in.

    You say that 666 is merely metaphor, but then for what? It is a solar reference, like 888 for Christos. These derive from sophisticated geometry, and the names derived from the numbers. Same for your little fishies.

    That wasn't part of Atwill's analysis.
    The Jesuits invented both the Preterism and Futurism Schools at the very same time, and both were endorsed by the papacy, in the cause of defending against the ubiquitous Protestant claim that the papacy was the AntiChrist. Albeit that the Church fathers were proud that the Roman destruction of the Temple in 70 CE was the perfect fulfillment of Jesus's 'generation' prophecy.

    Vespasian and Titus were known as being of the "good emperors", for their good deeds. In high contrast to the reputations of Tiberius, Caligula, Nero, and Domitian. Titus fulfilled Jesus's prophecy (as the first Second Coming), so how can he be an AntiChrist?

    I grew up in the Presbyterian Church, which had no Futurism until Jesuit influenced Low Church Evangelicals took it over via Entryism. It is Evangelical Futurism, not 'Protestant'. As far as I know, the official position of the Roman Church yet today, or until recently, is that Preterism is the reality. Of course, now they are quietly promoting an alien savior coming from outer space, with such as their LUCIFER telescope.

    You don't understand the metaphors because you are wearing rose colored glasses to boot.

    When the Baptists issued their original statement of Faith, they goofed up and included Predestination of the Elect. They soon realized that they needed to redact this as their demographic was the lower classes, the non-Elect. It simply would not do to have these people believe that they were either Predestined or of the Elect.

    Elect means: Elite. When a king dies without issue, his elite noble 'peers' gather as Electors to 'elect' the new king.

    In the Preterist Apocalypse, the Elect were warned so they rapturously could flee to safety, like to Pella, for war's duration. This was ceremonially re-enacted during 9/11 BTW, as the business leaders in the Twin Towers were off in Omaha, the nearest airport city to Pella, Iowa. They were joined there by Bush 43 after he had read his goat story to black school children in Jupiter, Florida.
    Thank you. ;)
  8. Richard Stanley

    Richard Stanley Administrator


    In a Pensacola, Florida rally Friday evening, Republican state Senator Doug Broxson suggested to supporters of Donald Trump that the president’s controversial decision to move the U.S. Embassy from Tel Aviv to Jerusalem may usher in the biblical end times.

    “Now, I don’t know about you, but when I heard about Jerusalem — where the king of kings [applause] where our soon coming king is coming back to Jerusalem, it is because President Trump declared Jerusalem to be capital of Israel,” Broxson said. The crowd cheered.

    Theological scholar Diana Butler Bass wrote a Twitter thread explaining the link between recognition of Jerusalem, evangelical Christians and the apocalypse. That is important because rebuilding the Temple is the event that will spark the events of the Book of Revelation and the end times.”

    According to Bass, Trump listens to the counsel of evangelical advisers who take such "end times” prophecies literally.

    “Of all the possible theological dog-whistles to his evangelical base, this is the biggest,” she continued. “Trump is reminding them that he is carrying out God’s will to these Last Days. They’ve been waiting for this, praying for this. They want war in the Middle East. The Battle of Armageddon, at which time Jesus Christ will return to the Earth and vanquish all God’s enemies.”

    She warned that for some evangelicals, this is considered a “climax of history.”

    “And Trump is taking them there. To the promised judgment, to their sure victory. The righteous will be ushered to heaven; the reprobate will be banished to hellfire,” Bass went on. “People believe this. Really believe this. Have given their lives to these ideas, sing about them in their churches, evangelize others, teach them in Sunday schools. And, this morning, with the news of Jerusalem, these people are ecstatic. This is the fulfillment of biblical prophecy. And Donald Trump is not only acting on a campaign promise, but enacting a theological one.”

    She went on to explain that the reason many white evangelicals supported Trump (to the tune of 80 percent) is that they actually believe he is an "instrument" of god.

    “They believe that Donald Trump is God’s instrument to move us closer to the Rapture, the Judgment, and the End,” she wrote. “Because to them, that’s actually the beginning — the beginning of their reward and heavenly bliss.” ...
  9. Republican panders to religious right. In other news, dog bites man while birds go tweet. Film at eleven.

    But if we really do say, nuke Iran and rebuild a Temple (as opposed to provoking the planned "Russian aggression" using NK and using it to justify a militarized world government where Trumpers and the like go into reeducation camps at best), I owe you a Coke. If things get to that point, I'll make sure it has real cocaine in it like it used to, we'll need it.

    But if so, why does the "Russian collusion" narrative continue eleven and a half months after the election? Sore losers are one thing, laying psychological groundwork for a wartime mentality another.
  10. Richard Stanley

    Richard Stanley Administrator

    Hi Michael,

    My suspicion about this is that Trump et al. needs a pretext (against his Deep State frenemy) to dissolve the Republic, ala Julius Caesar (the second Jewish messiah BTW). If you have indeed been reading more here lately then you'll know that I'm generally following a millennial construct, and a general redux of the surrounding historical context from the first (Preterist) Second Coming.

    If I am correct, then preliminary warfare is needed to clear the Palestinians and Arabs away from the Temple Mount, so as to allow for the construction (and after the environmental impact reports and other bureaucratic approvals of course :rolleyes:). And, I'm not sure if they have the requisite red heifer yet.

    As such, we're still about 50 years away from your needing to book us airline tickets to Omaha, Nebraska, where we can take a driverless bus to Pella, Iowa - to avoid the real 7 years of Tribulation. If you haven't bought me that 'original' Coke before then maybe they'll have one on the plane?

    When I was working in Spain for a few weeks in 1980 I was drinking Cuba Libres (rum and Coke), but I was rather nervous doing so when I had to sit and chat with the retired leader (a Franco partisan of the civil war) of the local Guardia Civile. I was a radical libertarian back then, so fortunately I didn't have to say the word Republican to him. But I'm pretty sure, now, if he knew what a libertarian was he wouldn't have liked that any better. I feel much better about drinking with you, ... I hope. ;)

    Did you see my post where the Russians, including Putin and his 'new' found love for the Orthodox Church, consider libertine America under Satan's control. This despite Putin and Trumps mutual admiration. Well, Jesus and Satan had a nice get together some years (a "generation") before the Preterist apocalypse's Second Coming. Didn't Jesus tell him that he could run the show (for 1,000 years?) until Domesday 1070? And Satan replied, "Yeah, You take the high road, and I'll take the low road ... they all lead to Rome."
  11. I certainly concede that Putin's "Christianity" may be about as genuine as Bruce Jenner's ladyhood. In fact I half-expected him to be promulgated as a "savior" figure, with Obama playing Antichrist (with runner-up Pope Francis as the false prophet). Whoever the controlling cult truly is, they sure love those false dichotomies.

    But things seem to be drifting away for the moment from a "let's nuke Iran because that's what Jeezus wants" scenario and toward demonizing Russia. You seem to be saying "today Russia, tomorrow Iran/the Mideast". Perhaps, but all indications were it would have been the other way 'round, and within two years, if Hillary had gottten in.

    Which leads me to believe that a genuine monkey wrench has been thrown into the works. Of course they can adapt. And dissolving (or at least degrading) the Republic on a pretext is an old game, even older than 2001.

    I concede as well that a futuritst "end time" is being engineered, but I maintain that the real end was in 70 A.D., nothing but the spiritual and eternal Messianic kingdom of the New Covenant truly "is", despite temporal power games involving religion. Hence the necessity of engineering futurist "fulfillments" (Scripture never mentions "seven years of tribulation" for example). The kids can play "house" all they want, Daddy's name is on the deed. They will simply keep having apocalypses until they get their global dictatorship, or the "unfulfilled" portion of prophecy (according to the Orthodox scheme) catches up with them.

    But the next eschatological contrivance may be much as you describe, *despite* my misgivings.
  12. Richard Stanley

    Richard Stanley Administrator

    What do you mean it would have been the other way around? I have no idea what order these aspects will occur in. Zbigniew Brzezinski framed matters as a grand chess game with Russia against the west, which I consider just another engineered false dichotomy or dialectic. I agree with Admiral Flavio Barbiero's take on the schism between the Roman and Orthodox Churches being contrived being the basis of another false dialectic. Another engineered drama, for the long term sake of divide and conquer.

    In any case, I'm of the school that the Clintons, the Bushes, Obama, and Trump are all in the same bag. And that Hillary, with Bubba's help, clearly tanked the election for Trump. It's all kabuki theater.

    Yes, they can always adapt, with contingency plans and such.

    But it does go out of its way to refer to 3.5 years using a variety of time units: days, months, and such.

    I forget where we left off before, but I am becoming ever more confident that the sequence of events from the collapse of the Late Bronze Age, including Samson, the Nazarite with weird hair and curious riddles (evoking covfefe) was indeed a millennial precursor. Samson went off seeking "an occasion against the Philistines." The pissed off Philistines ended up destroying Shiloh, and later rose the new order du jour, of the hated kings. The Israelites hated the Judean kings for their big government, and that David and Solomon had press-ganged them into laboring on their building projects. Sound familiar?

    Before the collapse of Shiloh, Samson, in the base of the Philistine temple caused two pillars to collapse, and about 3,000 dancing Philistines died. On 9/11 about 3,000 American metaphorical 'Philistines' are alleged to have died from the two towers collapsing. The Philistines lashed out, as did we, and the rest is history. Godless Americans are being characterized today as such 'Philistines' by the Russians, the Iranians, the Traditionalist Roman Catholics, Joe Atwill, evangelicals, ISIS, North Korea, etc.. WTF?

    In my thread about the Egyptian origins of Freemasonry, I veered off into the Judges, where Barbiero's mention of various judges (not Roy Moore) got me off into looking closes at most of these judges, including Samson, of whom Trump's acting seems clearly based upon. With that thread, and my thread about the Sabbah brother's analysis in their Secrets of the Exodus, one can clearly that the 18th and 19th Dynasty Egyptian kings initiated all this monkey (actually chimpig) business in Canaan. And that's what the Bible says as well.

    But if the "real end" was also engineered, then wouldn't all the other 'ends' have to be engineered as well?

    On your "real end" they even included a transitional dude whose name transitioned from Saul to Paul. This Saul bookended the prior millennial age with another transitional Saul at its contrived Alpha. Your "real" Alpha also honored the Greek Saviors, Castor and Pollux, that Paul got to ride a ship named after them.

    What would it mean to you if your end was really engineered as well?
  13. I mean, that Hillary was to destroy Iran as CIC as she helped destroy Libya and Syria as SoS. Then "Russian aggression" (provoked by continuous "soft" Western aggression) in the form of nuclear attacks on military assets (cities and populations being preserved for their productive capacity and held for ransom by Russia via nuclear blackmail) would be the pretext for branding all dissenters from the establishment as "Russian agents", and the formation of a militarized world government, all to occur in 2020 or thereafter. (After, of course, Hillary collapsed the economy and sold it off piecemeal to foreign interests.)

    This is why Billy Bubba revoked the "launch on warning" protocol and instructed the military to prepare to absorb a nuclear first strike, then retaliate (because you can't!). Our more esoteric antimissile defenses would be on standdown during such a strike, then go online once the nuclear sword of Damocles was dangled over our supposedly defenseless head. Then Russia would be destroyed (with help from Chinese treachery), and anybody not with the new regime, off to the reeducation camps, or off with their heads.

    Now Trump is no schoolboy, but I think he represents a more nationalist-corporatist aspect of the "deep state" as opposed to a globalist-militarist faction. (Witness all he trolling done for him by professional mindfucker Steve Piecenick.) His connections to the Bush/Clinton cabal were more superfacial than you assume, and at worst I see him as Reagan Jr., with a slightly less malevolent administration. His maverick demeanor could be planned for at a higher pay grade than the political arena/theater, and plans may have altered because the Hillary scenario did not "test well with audiences" who are more awake these days. But the evidence suggests he is as at least genuine enough to have upset their apple cart temporarily.

    As for "the (Preterist) end", if it turns out to be more bullshit, I will chuck it like I chucked the rapture, the trinity, and the immortality of the soul, and other bullshit. I LOVE to chuck bullshit! But if the supernatural is rejected out of hand because "there has to be some other explanation"...does there? Whatever explanation requires the least contortion of the facts is probably true, be it natural or super.

    Some things however are a matter of perspective: maybe Paul's ship was named Castor and Pollux because his civilization was run by pagans and pagans name things after pagan deities? Maybe I'm writing this on Monday even though I don't worship the moon? Maybe it is a case of appropriation, as in the case of YHWH being billed as the Sky-Rider to insult "Baal", could an emissary of the true Savior spread His message using a boat named after false ones as a means of recovering the title? ? Do the letters spell "GOD IS NOWHERE" or "GOD IS NOW HERE"? That is the inevitable impasse.

    It is not inconsistent with a Deity to reach such an impasse, necessitating a leap of faith (trust based on existing evidence). Nor is it proof of one. That proof materializes once you take the leap, and it cannot be imparted by another.
  14. Richard Stanley

    Richard Stanley Administrator

    I think that scenario may indeed have been one alternate road to the new imperium. And, of course, the Russians would need to take out our submarines as well.

    But I really think that you are too in love with this notion of Trump as being in some form of real opposition to Hillary, and the Deep State. Its all for fooling the sheep that something else is going on, while the realpolitik is carried out subrosa, the way it always was, and is. "Steve Piecenick" was also preaching holy war to a Vatican audience. One of his favorite books is The Art of War, which focuses on Machiavellian deception.

    Trump is a perfect candidate to be a non-Manchurian Candidate, in that he was likely compromised early on. If not from his late 80's visit to the Soviet Union, then from when he attended Jesuit Fordham, and they learned how easy he was to control - because of his personality including narcissistic sociopathy, at least. Trump admitted in his The Art of the Deal, that he was assisted in his Soviet visit by the tourist agency run by the KGB. Just a coincidence that Putin's job back then was recruiting Western businessmen to serve as intel agents for them, sometimes using kompromat. And do you think that such as the CIA was not aware of that as well? They kept a very close eye on all such businessmen traveling to Eastern bloc countries, especially the USSR.

    In The Art of the Deal he even lied about his heritage, claiming that his family was from Sweden. His grandfather once visited Sweden, but was really from most Catholic Bavaria, where the little Austrian immigrant got his political start. For once, Trump admitted his a lie, stating that he said Sweden, because he knew how troubling Germany might be (especially Bavaria). His father was in the anti-Catholic (back then) KKK, and Donald was raised Presbyterian (because of his rarely mentioned mother's heritage). But, he was sent to Jesuit Fordham, somewhat like Bubba went to Jesuit Georgetown (after Yale), and the Podestas, and .......

    All superficial. This is how populist demogogues have always done it.

    I wish I had time, but there are too many linkages, below the surface between the Clintons and Trump, the latter's populo-nationalism is ONLY for show, ... and that he knows (pretending to be crazy) that he has complete psychological control of his emotion driven sheep. The Clintons have an almost identical political arc, as having appealed to the peeps via their Democratic politics, however, it was corporate driven, practicing the Third Way 'triangulation', as did Gingrich on the right. The underground connections between the Clintons and the Bushes are even more amazing. .....

    Trump is still playing hard-line with Iran, as did Hillary, he is sucking up to the Saudis, and Trump's recognition of Jerusalem as Israel's capitol can only be seen as seeking peace in some post-apocalyptic lens. ISIS is/was similar to Al Qaeda, both Western plausible deniability fronts controlled via Saudi / Sunni funding. The target audience was mostly the Western sheep under the thrall of consensus reality mindset.

    Trump has not exposed this, he has not exposed the Federal Reserve, he has not ... done anything to challenge consensus reality, despite hinting that he would - on various aspects.

    If you would be interested in discussing this important topic (The first Second Coming) further, we should really open a new thread, or look for an appropriate one probably already open. In any case, I assert that your 'real' Second Coming was not only engineered by an integral part of a repeating 'process' that started with the 18th and 19th Dynasty kings of Egypt, at least. And that the totality of evidence, including for this being the engineered case for your 'real' Second Coming is overwhelming. If you have the eyes to see, that is. I have confidence in you.

    But, I'll start it here, and if you want, we'll get Jerry to move it.

    If Jesus actually took back control of the Earth from Satan in 70 AD, then what, exactly was accomplished, then -- and for the last 2,000 years. I say that most of European humanity, at least, was put under the feudal system of Roman Christianity, the papacy indeed being the crown of crowns, as the self-appointed (aka engineered) vicar (substitute) of Christ on Earth. Cui bono? And where did these people get the idea? I say from Genesis 47, where Joseph colluded with 'Pharaoh', to manipulate the free markets and place all free Egyptians into bondage. Joseph then moved all the new serfo-slaves around the country willy-nilly (as all good serfo-slaves should be done so) and made them pay 20% 'rent' to Pharaoh and himself.

    These serfo-slaves were undoubtedly happy, as the Bible says. Maybe this is where the American slave business went wrong, eh? Unlike in Genesis 47 the American slaves were not properly conditioned first, looking engineered starvation and poverty in the face, rather rudely stolen off their lands and thrown into some dubious transportation means. Well, live and learn. Or read the Good Book a little closer next time, eh?

    And then (returning to later Europe) those evil ones, of the Renaissance and Enlightenment upsetting the divine apple cart - of the nice rent based landlord system. Long wars ensued, and the emancipated serfs, aka slaves, were glad to hop on ships and go to a new land, where they were promised that they could become landlords themselves, if only they would exterminate the new evil Canaanites.

    And so, Michael, was the above divine apple cart upset 'organically', or was it 'engineered'?

    Romans 11, metaphorically focuses on the 'grafting' of a wild (olive) branch onto the Root of (the olive tree of) Jesse. Tell me, is grafting a natural process, ... or an 'engineered' one?

    Well, maybe YHWH came down to Earth again, and did the grafting by hand? He did, after all, spend all night in a wrestling match with Jacob, and couldn't defeat Jacob (the latter thus becoming known as 'Israel').
  15. Richard Stanley

    Richard Stanley Administrator

    Christian slaves, serve your human masters as if they were Christ himself. And Christian masters, reciprocate the love, especially as to help create more Christian slaves with your reciprocating purple (royal) wand of Love.

    5Servants, be obedient to them that are your masters according to the flesh, with fear and trembling, in singleness of your heart, as unto Christ; 6Not with eyeservice, as menpleasers; but as the servants of Christ, doing the will of God from the heart; 7With good will doing service, as to the Lord, and not to men: 8Knowing that whatsoever good thing any man doeth, the same shall he receive of the Lord, whether he be bond or free.

    9And, ye masters, do the same things unto them, forbearing threatening: knowing that your Master also is in heaven; neither is there respect of persons with him.

    10Finally, my brethren, be strong in the Lord, and in the power of his might. 11Put on the whole armour of God, that ye may be able to stand against the wiles of the devil. 12For we wrestle not against flesh and blood, but against principalities, against powers, against the rulers of the darkness of this world, against spiritual wickedness in high places.
    (Ephesians 6, KJV)​

    Hmmm, flesh and blood slavery -> Good; principalities and powers of this world (Hillary) , --> Bad.

    Lock her up!!! Lock her up!!!

    "Eyeservice", "menpleasers"? It's those lying, naked beauty queens from Satan that tried to lead poor Donald astray, but rather he toils humbly ever in our service, the Suffering Servant du jour.

    Lock them up!!!, Lock them up!!!
  16. As for all the bad words in there, Jesus will forgive me (I hope).
    Yeeaahh... that's your interpretation.

    Elsewhere Paul warns that anyone's "bondsman" in the temporal sense is Christ's free man (genuine freedom as opposed to illusory bondage, and a free man in tbe illusory temporal sense is really Christ's bondsman; to serve Christ is to be free from all temporal power structures. You only rebel against those when there is a conflict of interest between Christ's will and theirs; e.g. Christ does not care if you carry a Roman legionnaire's baggage two miles innstead of one--thats just helping someone (and going two miles because you want to rather than one because you were forced to is what makes you free,).

    This is why Christ said to "render unto Caesar the things which are Caesar's". Because nothing *really* belongs to Caesar, only to God; God's covenrntal children are the ones who will"inherit all things".

    So the passages you cite mean: You serve Christ, by doing others good out of love.
    If they have the illusion of control, thinking they are exploiting you or extracting good from you by force, make sure that it IS an illusion by doing it because you *want* to! Otherwise you are "menpleasers", truly the slaves of men.

    And if not, wasn't all that written prior to A.D. 70 anyway?
    Last edited: Dec 12, 2017
  17. Sorry, keyboard trouble, continuing:

    Post-parousia, those principalities and powers only "rule" those who are not "in Christ", though those who are in Christ may be good to such slaves; even pre-parousia, "God has already enthroned us in heavenly places in Christ Jesus", "you are complete in him who is above all principality and power".

    To use profane terms: it does one no good to be king, if you are only King Shit of Turd Mountain. Any one who took the upgrade from "turd" transcends your authority.

    Or consider the old military joke, where the paratrooper, the Marine, and the Navy Seal are all sitting around the campfire arguing over which branch of the service is toughest--while the Green Beret sat there silently poking the fire...with the tip of his penis. 'Such is the kingdom of God."

    As for Trump, at my most optimistic, I view him as a slightly more sincere, less charismatic Reagan. If he can be said to be compromised, he believes he can compromise right back, hence pizza/pedogate and the rash of Washington and other sexual harassers being taken down, far eclipsing any rhetoric about "pussy grabbing". Certainly the type of demagoguery and dialectic you assign to his case is par for the course, I concede; but I still see at least a birdie in his case. Doesn't make him Tiger Woods.
  18. Richard Stanley

    Richard Stanley Administrator

    Good padre, everything here is conditioned by 'perspective', and one's perspective depends upon where they stand, or where and how they get to die for God's greater Glory.

    Your common theological exegesis profits well the Roma elites that established the church, same as it was before, and will ever be.

    The Traditional Christian caste system that Paul delivered us, has no class mobility, and one's simple acceptance via faith (albeit and Catholic works) earns one their metaphorical eternal swampland in Florida, where they can stand around in robes 24/7/365.25 singing glorious hymns to the Sun (aka the Aton, aka El, aka Sol ... Sol Invictus, etc.), e.g. the Hymn to the Aton (aka Psalms 104). At least Beyonce has given them all a new hymn to help cut the eternal boredom, "Halo."

    I have this suspicion that Buddhism, the original version, at least, scared the living golden turds out of Alexander's Hellenistic Shit Kings, and thus they created the ultimate corruption of it in adapting Plato's caste system and Logos. They employed Philo to syncretize it all with Judaism, while later his 'Alexander' nephew ran a Roman legion for Christ Titus during the war of the Second Coming.

    All is vanity .... and casuistry.

    Big whoop. Your Christian masters enslaved most of the humanity that they could for 2,000 years and you're fine with it. Now we have the most 'free' libertarians ala Rand and the Austrian School, and Goethe would still tell them today that there are none more enslaved that those who 'believe' that they are 'free'. A fine gift, an intellectual Trojan Horse, from the Mont Pelerin Society ultramontaines.

    The solar Christos is an avatar for the imperial emperors, and the substitutional "Vicars", and there is no theological lipstick that you can put on this pig that can convince me otherwise. I know where those 153 fishies in the net came from. And so did the Flavians, with their fish and anchor iconography, the original symbol of Xianity before the cross.

    Once a big fish was caught. It was so big that it was brought to Domitian's summer villa, and all the Roman pooh-bahs were summoned to a meeting, to determine what to do about the amazing fish. The fish was soooo Yuuuge that it was decided they needed to have a bigger bowl made especially for it. Today that villa is the Pope's summer getaway. Just a coincidence, of course. But that's not where the 153 fishies came from.

    Go in peace good padre. The calm before the storm.

    Die Gedanken sind frei, wer kann sie erraten,
    sie fliegen vorbei wie nächtliche Schatten.
    Kein Mensch kann sie wissen, kein Jäger erschießen
    mit Pulver und Blei: Die Gedanken sind frei!

    Ich denke was ich will und was mich beglücket,
    doch alles in der Still', und wie es sich schicket.
    Mein Wunsch und Begehren kann niemand verwehren,
    es bleibet dabei: Die Gedanken sind frei!

    Und sperrt man mich ein im finsteren Kerker,
    das alles sind rein vergebliche Werke.
    Denn meine Gedanken zerreißen die Schranken
    und Mauern entzwei: Die Gedanken sind frei!

    Drum will ich auf immer den Sorgen entsagen
    und will mich auch nimmer mit Grillen mehr plagen.
    Man kann ja im Herzen stets lachen und scherzen
    und denken dabei: Die Gedanken sind frei!
    Last edited: Dec 13, 2017
  19. Richard Stanley

    Richard Stanley Administrator

    This free Coke is on Jesus:

    For more on the show, that more broadly humorously frames what in actuality is the dark agitprop engineering of the current culture war aspect of the War on (the ironically pagan) Christmas. If you don't have any zealots for your next second coming, someone's gonna have to make some ... enemies. Xenophobic foils for the unfolding new global age, that is. These new foils are now provisionally branded the 'Useful Trumpets'.
  20. Richard Stanley

    Richard Stanley Administrator

    The following 2 hour presentation by Walter Veith is titled, The Trump Card. It covers most everything that I have written about, including many more reference sources. Veith is a devout Seventh Day Adventist, and so his take comes from his particular religious filter, but the presentation is mostly talking about the contemporary political facts unfolding, the dots so-to-speak, and thus leaves it up to the audience to connect them how they please. In any case, his facts overlap with my thinking, mostly. The main difference is that he sees everything as the fulfillment of divine Biblical prophecy, and I see it as the insanely cynical (and bloody) portrayal of a script - for geopolitical ends of an elite.

    Importantly, he sees Trump much like I do, as an integral agent of the prophecy / script. The discussion lays out the significance of cultural degradation to the mechanism of achieving the synthesis. But Veith, at least in this presentation, does not go beyond Rev 13 and the Beast, and thus we are left to ponder what the 'Second Coming of Christ is to accomplish -- in contradistinction to the religious reunification that Trump is overtly supporting. This between the various Christians, Messianic Jews, and even Sunni Islam. But importantly, not Shia Islam. This latter portents to some of the coming scripted apocalyptic war, that Trump hints at IMHO.

    Like I do, he spends considerable time looking at the significance of the undoing of the Reformation, and how it fits into the unfolding schema.

    If The Beast is for this unfolding ecumenicism, then what is the coming Christ for - or against? Trumps support for religious ecumenicism, under the global banner and crown of the papacy, is oddly also under the banner of nationalism. It seems an oxymoron, like Veith points out for Mike Pence's being an 'evangelical Catholic'.

    The script of Revelation holds out the hope for us that Trump's fascism (which Veith elaborates on the (Traditionalist) Catholic support for) is to be undone by our 'savior', but to what actual end? Caveat emptor!!!

    I mentioned 'synthesis' in a prior paragraph and here I did mean this from a Hegelian Dialectic POV, which Veith discusses as well. And so the entire unfolding process of hyper-polarization, cultural degradation, culture war with such as Islam and secularization, Nationalism vs. Globalization, etc., is part of the man-made Hegelian process - designed to achieve the desired synthesis. It is NOT some organic construct of revenge-seeking Jews such as Joseph Atwill asserts via his thinly veiled cultural Catholicism.

    And so, while Veith's presentation of facts is otherwise excellent, the central and key problem with religious based analysis is that such prophecy came to us via the very institution that the prophecy rails against. This is a fairly sophisticated means of deception where the deceiver (the Church and its agents) informs the intended dupe of the deceiver's fault.

    Last edited: Jan 12, 2018

Share This Page