Listeners' Comments on RedIce podcast

Jerry Russell

Staff member
The following comments were posted at Redice in response to our 4/13 podcast there:

Excellent, excellent, excellent...

Loved this interview and I draw a lot of confidence to stand in my own power to point to the much deeper oligarchical messages that are in all sorts of literature. I thank Joseph Atwill for opening up the idea of using typology as a way of deciphering the intent of the writer. I am still practising how to read this way.
I'm in a book group and my colleagues must be tired of me `going off on one' because I refuse to stay at the surface level of the text. I can now see how popular literature and the ideas of the writers are all (or perhaps nearly all) chosen and `sold' to us in order to shape our thoughts, opinions, likes and dislikes.
Last month we read A Room with a View by EM Forster. There is loads of symbolism, and one strong vision I noticed is about half way through the story. Three of the male characters were bathing naked in what was thought of by the female character Lucy as her `sacred pool'. At the same time Lucy, her mother and her then to be fiance witness these 3 naked men and Forster gives the scene an air of comedy. However, later in the novel Lucy feels the pool is lost to her forever. I interpreted this piece as a threat encapsulated by Forster who was educated at Cambridge and part of the Bloomsbury group who were a cultural steering group back in the early 20th century in England. His threat seemed to be telling us that a trinity is intent on destroying the fount of all that is natural as well as pushing civilisation into a backwater as the sacred pool is drained of its culture and life sustaining waters.
The book was first published in 1909, but the content although tame by today's standards would have been inconceivable to have been published into the public domain in an England of 1909. My grandmother was Edwardian and I know that Forster would never have got away with publishing such content at that time. It is my hypothesis that he published the book in 1909 to circulate amongst his peers for discussion and perhaps to inspire new writers like DH Lawrence. The book was republished 40 years later in the early 1950s in a war torn and very changed England, one in which the populace was perhaps ready to embrace new ideas of all sorts and as we see today, they have been mostly degenerate ideas.
The current book of my group is Pat Barker's Regeneration based on anthropologist and Freudian psychologist WH Rivers and his relationship with WW1 poet and officer, Siegfried Sassoon. I have developed my arguments coherently as to what the writer was driving at. I actually enjoy literature far more now because I can read the writer's intent and not just their narrative.
Anyways, thank you RIC and guests.

#10 - karen2uk - 21/04/2015 - 15:59

Shooting the Bull
Interesting as usual Redice.
The reference in the second part (at 16 minutes) between Sagittarius and Taurus, it not entirely accurate.
Sagittarius governs religion, philosophy, what is far off (over the rainbow) unfamiliar, foreign. He is saying you are not that, but you are like Taurus. Taurus is the Heirophant of the tarot, the orator of the established order. This is the bull that is in front of the EU building, this is the material order, what has solidity, what has been established.
The symbolism of shooting the bull therefore is that of attaining a different perspective.
Also, the I-Ching hexagram 26 refers to shooting the bull and gives a fuller description if how resources (Taurus) are accumulated. Without writing a dissertation, I hope this was of some use to you.

#9 - N1G3L - 21/04/2015 - 00:38

The corrosion of western culture and society and using integration as a weapon, I might be crazy, but I think Mr. Atwill is talking about #WhiteGenocide.

I feel like Joseph is doing the kind of work that will take the rest of my life to fully explore, in the same spirit as Manly P. Hall and that's a good thing.

#8 - MrWily - 20/04/2015 - 21:23

Great Exposure of the Control Agenda through the Arts
Brilliant commentary! I was born in the 1950's and am a survivor of the Hog Farm generation. I was forced to read that awful Salinger book in school at age 12! Later, I always felt something very creepy coming from the Grateful Dead (horrible music, dumb lyrics, painful to listen to.) Even today, if I happen to hear a Beatles song while shopping at the grocery, it feels so unsettling, like some entity is still trying to latch on to me. I also attended (and dropped out) of Art College where de Kooning and Pollack were, unbelievably, considered heros of the art world! Thank You Red Ice for helping to REVEAL many truths!

#7 - Cynthia Low - 20/04/2015 - 16:29

Jerry Russell

Staff member
Comments, continued....

Three audiences
The book seems to have at least three messages aimed at three sets of reader.

1) Regular Jewish readers. They will know the author is Jewish because they always take the trouble to ask. They will read it as a critique of western gentile society with a warning to stay away from it, that it will drive them insane, that they must always go "home" to the (Jewish) family, that desire and affection must be reserved for Jewish women ("sisters" literally or metaphorically).

2. Regular white western readers. They will not know or think to consider that the author is Jewish, if they do know he is Jewish they will have been taught that it doesn't matter because we are all "Americans". They will read it as one of their own criticising their own society. The message is then that if you criticise your own society you will go mad, but madness is a morally correct and sophisticated response. Also it is quite fine to regress to being a dependent child within the parental family and / or institutions rather than becoming an effective adult. I see this as a direct attack upon the individual, primarily, designed to encourage and glamorise mental illness, with the purpose of disarming and invalidating the individual politically, professionslly and socially. The damage to the family structure is secondary, but further destabilises later generations (if there are any).

3) The Freemasonry references may be there but I think that is just part of the criticism of white people. Freemasonry is not for Jews. You could say that Freemasonry creates "phony" Jews, from a Jewish perspective. I am not a Freemason so no idea what the message might be.

On a narrative level I think it is aimed at a Jewish readership as a group narrative (being "expelled" repeatedly, being an outsider, being alienated, always returning to the tribe / family) and at a white readership as an individual narrative (exploiting resentment of upper classes, alienation due to real loss of tradition (American Jews kept traditions and had community), promoting " dropping out" into insanity, encouraging subliminal incest and pedophilia to instil guilt / confusion and distance siblings from each other).

The details all work both ways e.g. "I kill people in this hat" - well, it is a hunting hat and hunting is European white teadition, not a Jewish tradition. So it can be "I kill people when I wear a hunting hat" (mocking European hunting tradition) or "I kill people who wear this hat" i.e. I kill white Europeans. Note that Salinger volunteered to do deNazification tasks and to interrogate German prisoners of war (nazi hunting in red hat).

The hype around the book and its association with lone assassins seems to be designed to stigmatize "loners" and solitary independent people who do have valid criticisms of their own society and would be natural leaders if not derailed into insanity.

The other Salinger books explicitly focus on gifted / high IQ individuals, who I think are the more precise white targets of this book. He exploits the sense of alienation gifted people are notorious for, and which is totally different to Jewish alienation / outsider syndrome which is a shared feeling in homogenous community, not an individual condition.

Salinger himself had an average IQ - so why was he writing about the interior life of high IQ people at all, let alone those outside his culture.

#6 - Sarah - 19/04/2015 - 14:14

I am reminded of the video of Bob Dylan saying he had made a deal / bargain to get where he is today. I can't say he seems very happy about it. Maybe it was the way of the Beatles as well. very sad, and I would like to think it is not possible. This is, as usual, a fine interview.

#5 - karen randall - 18/04/2015 - 23:32

Wow! what a great interview. Great work Henrik, Joseph, & Jerry. Can't wait to get your book of oligarch speak, Joseph.

#4 - Brian T. Kaufman - 18/04/2015 - 22:53

"Freemasonry, with a central mystery concerning the identity of the secret society"

Oh really?

On October 28th, 1927 the "Jewish Tribune of New York, states in an article, "Masonry is based on Judaism. Eliminate the teachings of Judaism from the Masonic Ritual and what is left?" Also speaking on this subject, the well known rabbi, Isaac Wise, states, "Freemasonry is a Jewish establishment, whose: history; grades; official appointments; passwords; and explanations, are Jewish from beginning to end."

#3 - EE - 17/04/2015 - 19:06

Another brilliant show. Thank God for Redice! You bring together the very best of contemporary academic scholars, with young scholars necessarily working outside the formal academic framework. Thank you, thank you, thank you.

#2 - Tim Howells - 17/04/2015 - 12:29

oh hollowood..."exposing" it to hide it in plain sight...muddying the waters, mixing truth and lies and craziness and jokes and jumbling it together, so anyone who goes down this rabbit hole is either effected by the subconscious memory of films like this and in turn not wanting to seem like a nut, or speak about a controversy and trigger the a subconscious reaction from someone else who has only heard it from a movie source before and thinks the speaker is a nut:
That's the Catcher:

few more snippets from the movie, I don't necessarily agree with the narrator's explanation...:

There are many more examples of this as I'm sure you know.
#1 - salman - 17/04/2015 - 04:31