911 Pentagon

Sure! It seems obvious that the intention was for the public to believe a lightpole was knocked flying by the plane wing, and that it hit the taxi, thus confirming the alleged trajectory of the plane across the bridge.

A segment of a real lightpole, much larger in diameter, thicker walled, deformed, jagged and tapered, would have been very unpredictable as a projectile weapon.
The 12 foot x 4 inch pole was engineered to accurately impact its target.

This pole would have been straight when fired, but bent along its length by the forces encountered inside the cab. Lloyde said that the pole pushed the passenger seat-back into the rear. Photos show that the left hand seat hinge was broken, but the seatback sprang up again. That would have bent this pole, and lifted it up so that it's rebound impact was higher.

Yes, it was a fake lightpole.

I posted this video The Eye of the Storm on my thread last night.
Since I added several new lines of evidence there 12 days ago, the views have jumped from 22,000 to 25,000. Quite extraordinary on an almost moribund site where the regulars have nearly all dropped off the perch, and no new members can join, thus there is no debate.

In the 12 hours since posting this video, there have been 400 views. Crazy! Virtually nobody knows about Lloyde England these days. About one third of the global population was born near or since 2001 and 9/11 means nothing to them. Yet this thread seems to be flagged now somehow, even though new readers cannot get notifications since they cannot login. Certain people are interested in the topic. Recent revival of Lloyde's story on various internet sites is having some effect at last.

I also wrote to Craig McKee to tell him about this video being deleted from Ranke's channel and suggesting that he post this valuable historical resource somewhere too. He still refuses to even consider any of my defenses of Lloyde England. Another pro-England friend posted some of my work on his Facebook account, which was quickly blocked.

I believe that this Lloyde England story is the only one from the whole day over all sites, where recognisable perpetrators are seen on video actually participating in the 9/11 crime. Most detractors loudly proclaim that it is neither here nor there whether an old man was confused about his location as the plane flew over him. That is missing the point entirely.

If Lloyde England was correct about his location, and numerous videos plus eyewitness testimony show this to be true, then there was necessarily a premeditated, well-rehearsed tightly-executed script for this scene, requiring bit-part actors (Detective Don Fortunato, PPO bodyguard Aubrey Davis; 5 other Security Detail officers; white van driver; towtruck operators), anti-publicist (Steve Riskus) and an author/stage manager (Secretary of Defense Donald Rumsfeld).

The FBI confiscated every CCTV video from surrounding businesses within hours of the event, and even appeared that evening at Eugenio Hernandez' home to confiscate the amateur video shot from on top of the bridge. Photographers were arrested and handcuffed that morning. Who can tell how many other photos and videos there originally were from the Pentagon?

The miracle is that we have as many videos as we do thanks to FOIA requests.

What disappoints me is how few Truthers even try to see the crucial evidence hidden in plain sight on these videos.

Craig McKee and Adam Ruff loathe me for daring to suggest that Craig Ranke made some errors. Wayne Coste and Chris Sarns have never acknowledged my points, even the parts where I agree with them.

My post to David Chandler (who vociferously demands that we give the utmost respect to Lloyde England and his cab as witnesses to the Pentagon event, while denying every word of Lloyde's testimony), correcting his egregious fake defense of Lloyde England, apparently fell on deaf ears.

Your email to Aldo Marquis on my behalf Jerry, did not provoke a glimmer of interest in revisiting his early work on the subject, and nor has my resurrection of several of his old threads on forums. My many deliberately provocative comments on Craig Ranke's videos never got a nibble, and of course now that the video has been deleted, my detailed comments in defense of Lloyde England have also vanished - although I do have copies of them.

Rob Balsamo's initial interest quickly turned sour and I was accused of crashing his Pilots For 9/11 Truth forum, with the loss of all comments for several years.

My comments to former passionately pro-CIT commentators OneSliceShort etc have not received any response. My email to the erudite blogger Shoestring is unanswered.

The Lawyers' Committee for 9/11 Inquiry, whose YouTube channel hosts the video "FIRST TWO HANDHELD CAMERA VIDEOS of 9/11 AFTER 9.38 a.m." where I first discovered this evidence, stonily ignores my comments about the actual proofs contained within this video, while soliciting help and sending me news of their impending court case with requests for my money.

Posters on other forums are almost universally vicious in their ad hominem attacks, while sidestepping the actual content of my discussion.

For some reason, both Truthers and official fairy tale believers alike, distance themselves from the Lloyde England intrigue. It is as though both sides had been sternly warned off.

Yet that undercurrent of interest on my thread continues to silently increase!
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Ruby, your experiences with the 911 "Truth" movement inspire a tremendous sense of "deja vu" within me.

Back in the period from 2001 thru 2005 or so, I was diligently trying to follow everyone's research, participate in online discussions, publish some occasional articles, and generally make sense of the chaos. Rick and I started working together in 2002, when he saw my website and wrote me a long email. (That email from Rick contained more common sense than anything else I'd seen for some time among 911 researchers, or for that matter anywhere or anytime.)

It was amazing to me how everyone seemed attached to their theories, unwilling to really look at evidence, and unable to show clear, coherent and consistent analysis. The entire field degenerated into a cacophony of spook-naming and shaming.

And of course at a political level, there were several theories about who ultimately was to blame for the 911 conspiracy. There was the official theory, that Bin Laden and Al Qaeda and maybe Iraq and/or Afghanistan were to blame. Many within the truth movement advocated for "Let It Happen On Purpose" (LIHOP) theories, meaning that Bin Laden and his twelve intrepid hijackers were primarily to blame, although the entire US government stood down and winked while it happened. Then there were those who blamed it on Bush, or perhaps Cheney & Rumsfeld. Some blamed it on the Israelis and Zionists, while others (not so many) blamed the Catholics. Or maybe the CIA, or capitalists in general. So whose fault was it? There was almost a complete vacuum of reliable evidence, but it didn't stop the arguments from turning acrimonious, and then viciously acrimonious.

And then there was the arrival of a strangely professional contingent of "911 truthers" who mostly hit the scene in 2005 or thereabouts. Folks with expensive business suits and elaborate resumes, leading obviously well funded campaigns to create leadership in the movement. Those people were determined to make sure that some avenues of research were closed off, like the Pentagon overflight theory. Suddenly it became vital for the health of the "truth movement" to achieve consensus around the idea that the Pentagon was struck by a large plane following the flight path defined by the light poles.

Faced with all this nonsense, Rick and I eventually decided to abandon 911 truth research, and look into the bigger picture. Sadly, we haven't yet experienced any steadily increasing undercurrent of interest... still a sleepy backwater here. So, congrats on your success in attracting a following.
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Thanks for your enlightening back story! Divide and conquer seems to be their effective technique for crushing all those many avenues of opposition of every flavour. But I found a loophole. Those released videos were not as innocuous as the FBI supposed. So I with my nitpicking diagnostic radiographer's skills and general contrariness, plus my conviction that Lloyde England was telling the truth, went to work.

I was reading somewhere today, where somebody claimed to have analysed the Gatecam footage and found that the resolution had been reduced and that purplish stripe inserted on the plane. Well I never believed that was a genuine image of a 757, and not a single testimony places it in that location, so a purple stripe here or there is of no consequence. But I have long had my suspicions that the other video footage was tampered with to reduce resolution.
Divide and conquer seems to be their effective technique for crushing all those many avenues of opposition of every flavour.

I could get myself in trouble by dissing each and every 911 truther that ever lived. In my better moments, I realize that along with many troublesome aspects of the movement, there was also a lot of passion, hard work and integrity. And if I worked hard at it, I could come up with the names of some totally awesome and impeccable researchers and activists who deserve nothing but admiration.

But rather than taking the risk of drawing up any lists of good guys and bad guys, I'm going to stick with broad generalizations. Any individuals out there reading this, you know who you are.
Did you save Richard's introductory email for posterity?

Yep, I still have it, as well as almost all my emails dating back to 1994. It was actually a cc; of an email to researcher Carol Valentine. It's pretty long, and I'm not sure if it's relevant to anything current.
Good to know you maintain such a database. I would expect nothing less from you!

4,400 views on my thread "LLOYDE ENGLAND VINDICATED" now in just 2 1/2 weeks.
I wonder why!

There are maybe 3 posters who debate with me sporadically, and a couple more who deliver short encouragement from time to time on AboveTopSecret forum in Aldo Marquis's old Mystery of the Moved Taxi thread, and about 30 bloodthirsty snarling cannibalistic predators on International Skeptics forum, but nobody really discusses the evidence as they at least used to do 10+ years ago.

The current tactic is belligerent derision, bombardment with barrages of off-topic questions, personal slights, misogynistic misrepresentation etc.
All the trademarks of ignorant bigoted bullies.

Not a single soul seems fazed by the revelation that PPO Aubrey Davis, bodyguard of Defense Secretary Donald Rumsfeld, left his boss to caper vulnerable about the lawn, and skived off to locate, retrieve and guard an obscure unknown cab driver during a photo session, instead.

Actual facts seem to fall on stony ground these days.

But there still remains that figure of 4,400 recent views on a nearly moribund forum where no new members' commenting is now possible.

Who can they be?
At last count this week, my thread at Letsrollforums.com, had garnered almost 48,000 views, of which 26,000 are from the past 6 months.

These views were after I began posting about the fact that Secretary of Defense Donald Rumsfeld, and his bodyguard that day, Pentagon Police Officer Aubrey Davis, were caught on multiple videos in the act of participating in the crime of Pentagon 9/11.

That is, within the first 3 1/2 minutes, Rumsfeld and his security detail team appeared with astonishing haste on the sidewalk next to Route 27, having allegedly walked from his office on the far side of the building, up a couple of floors, after first hearing about the explosion.

They then made a display of being "first responders", playing up to the photo opportunity, as a cover for their real purpose - to supervise and monitor the relocation of Lloyde England's taxi cab from the place where a pole was fired through its windscreen as the pkane flew across the highway (beside the Arlington National Cemetery wall, opposite the Heliport Tower), 350 metres south down the road to the Columbia Pike overpass bridge.

There, photos were taken of Lloyde's taxi posed beside a downed lightpole starting 11 minutes post impact, and Lloyde was later collected and deposited in the tableau another 7 minutes later, by Rumsfeld's bodyguard Aubrey Davis, who now guarded a humble unknown cab driver for several minutes during the photo shoot. Lloyde was then sent off home.

Although forum piranhas deny that there is anything surprising or untoward about this scenario, imagining that somehow the bodyguard of the second-most powerful government official in the land could make a random decision to go driving off to look for a taxi driver he theoretically had never met, then reunite him with his damaged relocated taxi about which he theoretically knew nothing, at the exact time and duration of the photos taken by a navy photographer ...

This part of my thread suddenly scored hundreds of views per day. An average of 1,000 views per week. Every time I would post more evidence on this theme, or new eyewitness testimony about the N9RTH-OF-CITGO FLIGHTPATH, the number of views would jump again.

Letsrollforums.com has had its membership closed for a couple of years, and the staunch remaining members are now very few indeed, so the thousands of views on my thread are from non-members who cannot post there, yet who have a keen interest in what I have to say. They have my thread flagged somehow, for some reason. As far as I know, this thread is the only evidence on any part of 9/11 which names perpetrators, and exposes them with considerable photo and video evidence taken within the first 20 minutes of impact.

Letsrollforums did open membership again in the past couple of weeks, probably because of the Covid-19 situation, which has generated a flurry of activity from old members. Quite a few people have joined, but I have not seen a single post from any of them.

For the 3rd time in recent months, the LetsRoll site is down. Last time it was several days before it was reinstated. It's a mystery as to what is going on there.
Yes, every aspect of Rumsfeld's behavior is suggestive of his role in 'staging' the events. These are consistent with his prior role in providing chemical warfare reagents to Saddam Hussein.

I have no experience with LetsRoll, but various forms of gatekeeping were and are rampant in such as the 9/11 truth movement, as should be expected under the circumstances of the matrix.
At last count this week, my thread at Letsrollforums.com, had garnered almost 48,000 views, of which 26,000 are from the past 6 months.

A possible explanation for the traffic, is simply that the LRF threads are linked from discussions at Craig McKee's truthandshadows.com site. A blurb at qnamedia (from 2018) claims that Truth and Shadows has generated 2 million hits over the years. It's also possible that Google is bringing some readers.
A possible explanation for the traffic, is simply that the LRF threads are linked from discussions at Craig McKee's truthandshadows.com site. A blurb at qnamedia (from 2018) claims that Truth and Shadows has generated 2 million hits over the years. It's also possible that Google is bringing some readers.
Thanks for the explanation. I do publish the web address of my thread when possible online too in discussions about Lloyde. But other threads alongside it with Lloyde England in the title, have only added a handful of views in the same time. Truth & Shadows has covered many more topics than Lloyde's cab, of course.
But other threads alongside it with Lloyde England in the title, have only added a handful of views in the same time.

Those other threads just have a few posts in them. Or, in the case of the thread on "Lloyde England and photomanipulation", most of the posts are ten years old.

I think part of what we're seeing is that each time a new post is added to a thread, followers of the thread come back to take a look at what's new. Rick's thread on "Trumping der Fuhrer" has accumulated 89,000 views, but this thread is 1,000 posts long. An average of about 90 views per new post.

I do believe your thread at LRF is getting a lot of attention, for whatever reason.
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Here is an interesting piece of evidence I found recently, strongly reinforcing the testimony of many eyewitnesses who saw the plane flying towards the Pentagon on the North side of the Citgo gas station, far from the official flight path claimed to be diagonally across the Columbia Pike overpass bridge.

This testimony was recorded by Citizen Investigation Team in 2006 when they interviewed Pentagon Police Sergeants William Lagasse and Chadwick Brooks, who were parked on or adjacent to the Citgo station, and Citgo employee, Robert Turcios. They also obtained corroborating evidence from numerous other highly credible witnesses, and there were many more testimonies besides those recorded by CIT.

However, despite the unanimous testimony of dozens of these witnesses, CIT was and still is pilloried for having discovered this. Their empirically obvious conclusions are derided, by both official story advocates, and disappointingly also by many "Truthers" who now reside in the David Chandler - Wayne Coste - Chris Sarns etc camp. Those individuals have infamously proposed that Sgt Lagasse must somehow have been mistaken, and seen the plane with his X-Ray vision superpowers, flying on the south side of the station, where the building and roof would have blocked the clear view of any normal mortal standing beside the gas pump on the North side, beneath the canopy.

The following information is something I discovered while scouring old threads, I think perhaps on Skeptics International, posted by an earnest German who was largely ignored by the trolls for his extremely lengthy and convoluted postulations, some very far-fetched.

But this one checks out. I have studied the Citgo station CCTV footage, and the testimony of the eyewitness involved, and it all fits. Unfortunately, CIT was never aware of this extra witness who had just pulled up to the opposite side of the same gas pump where Sgt Lagasse was parked. State Trooper Myrlin Wimbish can be seen driving east to west, outside the northern canopy, and coming to a halt opposite and a little to the west of Lagasse.

Because he was outside the canopy, the morning sun was shining from the east onto the rear of Wimbish's black and white patrol car, casting a reflection up onto the ceiling.

Wimbish was facing west, and he testified that he saw the plane flying across the top of the Navy Annex towards him and past him. He immediately pulled out and drove to the Pentagon, where he spent the rest of the day in rescue operations.

On the CCTV footage, we see the ceiling reflection change from a gleam to a significant white flash for what amounts to a single frame of the CCTV video, that is, 10 frames of the YouTube video. Normal video has 30 frames per second. Therefore, we can calculate that the Citgo CCTV was operating at 3 frames per second.

For a single one of those frames, or 1/3 of a second, something was strongly reflecting brilliant sunshine from the east and north of the Citgo station, down onto the rear of Wimbish's stationary car, and back up onto the canopy ceiling to his south. Careful scrutiny of the CCTV footage shows that Wimbish's car did not move until after the flash. The light can only have been reflected from a very large, very shiny, fast-moving airborne object to the north of the Citgo.

The David Chandler camp has put its money on a different phenomenon found on another CCTV video taken to the south of the station. Several seconds previous to the flash to the north, they found a tiny black mark on the road which they claim is the shadow of AA77 flying on the official flightpath. This little blot could as easily be a black cat crossing the road. It certainly cannot be the shadow of a 155 foot long, 124 foot wide 757 plane.

The flash seen in this photo is apparently as close as we are going to get, to absolute visual evidence of the plane flying north of Citgo. As soon as the flash occurred, the office staff can be seen in the composite CCTV footage, rushing towards the door. The manager testified that they heard the plane flying over, so close to them that it made the building shake, and that they immediately headed outside. If the Chandler theory were true, then the manager in fact went about his business for some time after the building shook ominously around him, before running to investigate.

Those individuals have infamously proposed that Sgt Lagasse must somehow have been mistaken

Have Chandler, Coste, Sarns etc., ever addressed the "unanimous testimony of dozens... of witnesses"? Is there a convenient summary of all this testimony somewhere, that could be linked or copy-pasted here?

Wimbish was facing west, and he testified that he saw the plane flying across the top of the Navy Annex towards him and past him.

I hadn't heard of Wimbish before either. Who interviewed him?

The light can only have been reflected from a very large, very shiny, fast-moving airborne object to the north of the Citgo.

Makes sense to me. It might help with naysayers if we could provide some sort of diagram showing the location of the security camera, the car, the canopy, the airplane, and the sun, for raytracing purposes.
Hi Jerry, thanks for your interest!
These forgotten snippets of evidence keep turning up.
Just 2 days ago I found video of the black towtruck approaching the scene of the crime, about 4 minutes prior to the Pentagon explosion. I then parked for several minutes at the Citgo station, before heading off about 35 seconds after the explosion, presumably to hook up the trailer waiting on the nearby Columbia Pike overpass cloverleaf, then drive a little further north to collect Lloyde England's taxi.

As usual, some very perspicacious questions from you which I will endeavour to fully address.

For starters, here is a 2011 newspaper article on Myrlin Wimbish.


The photo claims that he is standing under the flightpath of the plane, but he appears to be somewhat southeast of the Air Force Monstrosity Monument that was built east of the now demolished Navy Annex, whereas his own testimony proves that he was actually parked at the now-demolished CItgo Gas Station, facing the Navy Annex, when he saw the plane flying over the Annex towards him.

First responders forever changed
Jim Nolan Sep 9, 2011

Some things are hard to remember after 10 years.

The Sept. 11, 2001, terrorist attacks are not one of them.

"Every day when I wake up," says Mike Middleton, a Virginia State Police trooper who was one of the first responders to the Pentagon after it was struck by a jetliner at 9:37 a.m. "I can still smell the burning fuel. … I can still hear the arching explosions. I can still hear those things.

"Ten years later, it still feels like yesterday."

Thousands of people — police, firefighters, emergency medical personnel and just ordinary Americans — ran toward the terror when it struck that day. And for many first responders, the dark events that unfolded in New York, Pennsylvania and Northern Virginia on that bright and sunny morning haven't lost their sharp edge and continue to define their lives today.

"My car was facing toward the gas pumps and I'm looking at the plane coming toward me," says trooper Myrlin Wimbish Jr., who was near the Arlington County barracks within view of the Pentagon. His car started to rock as hijacked American Airlines Flight 77 veered and thrust toward its target.

"I'm looking at the silhouette and I said, 'Oh God,' " he recalled.

Wimbish, 61, and Middleton, 45, arrived minutes after the crash, entered the Pentagon and began climbing and crawling through wreckage and collapsed building debris in a frantic search for survivors.

Middleton was driving toward the barracks after hearing about the first plane crashing into the World Trade Center. When the Pentagon was struck, he sped straight to the scene.

He recalled seeing a huge fireball and hearing Wimbish's last radio transmission: "I'm going in. If I don't come out, so what."

Wimbish went right in through a hole near where the plane had crashed. "When I get three-quarters in there, something pinned me up against the wall and I was drenched," he says.

"Every time I hit a piece of the wall it would fall. The further back I got the warmer it got. … (I thought to myself,) 'What have I gotten myself into?' I'm looking for people and I can hear popping and booming and beating and bamming."

When Middleton entered the building, he too was drenched and met with pitch black smoke, stifling heat and the stench of burning jet fuel.

"There were chunks of the plane glowing and debris strewn everywhere," he says. "The only illumination you had was the chunks of the glowing aircraft."

Wimbish and Middleton met up with each other inside the building and were joined by a Pentagon police officer and another man in a white shirt whom Wimbish referred to as an "angel."

While Wimbish tried to hold up part of the wall near a way out, Middleton and the others began searching the floors immediately around the area.

"Without getting into too much detail, it was horrific the sights we were seeing," Middleton says, growing quiet during a recent interview at his home in Ashburn.

"It was a nightmare," Wimbish says.

* * * * *

Middleton suffered first- and second-degree burns in his throat and lungs and developed life-threatening sepsis, spending nine days in the hospital. His wife, Karen, remembers the bedside note he scribbled:
"Please take care of my wife and kids."

Wimbish was treated at the scene and released, but a few days afterward he collapsed from an electrolyte deficiency. He received six intravenous bags of potassium.

"The doctor said I should have been dead," says Wimbish, a divorced father with one son.

Once they recovered, Middleton and Wimbish were eager to return to duty. Wimbish, a master trooper, resumed his road patrol and personal mission to aid the hungry. Middleton set a goal to make the state police SWAT team and joined the elite unit in 2004, serving until 2008.

Both men were honored by their department, state government and numerous other organizations. They met other first responders who shared their experiences and helped one another get through tough times.

But the effects of the troopers' response on 9/11 linger in other ways. Years later, a smell, a sound, a place can trigger memories as fresh as that day.

"Just something about the building — you just feel something every time you go by there," Wimbish says.

"There are things that happened that day that will stay with me that I don't need to share with anybody."

Karen Middleton recalls the nightmares, and her husband calling out in the middle of the night: "I'm over here! I'm coming to get you!"

* * * * *

Both troopers believe the event has made them better people, brought them closer to their families and made them more mindful as law-enforcement officers in a post-9/11 world.

"Now if I'm going to work, it's, 'I love you.' I make sure everyone gets a hug and a kiss," says Middleton, the father of two boys, now 14 and 11.

"I don't go all out on this hero thing," Wimbish says. "The good Lord put me there for a reason. I just try to live my life a little better. I always tried to help people — now I try to help them a little more."

After participating in 9/11 commemorations in previous years, neither Middleton nor Wimbish feels compelled to publicly do so this time.

"I want to put more of 9/11 behind me so I can put their future ahead of me," says Middleton, who still wears the badge he wore on Sept. 11, 2001, seared by the heat of that day.

"I'll probably call Mike," Wimbish says. "And just be thankful that I'm here and with my loved ones, because a lot of people can't say that."

Arlington County barracks
This reference, and the stated location of the troopers "under the flight path of the plane", appear to have been errors on the part of the journalist who, like most, would have assumed that when Wimbish stated the plane flew over him, he must have been on the official south-of-Citgo flightpath.
But video shows that wimbish was on the North side of the Citgo.
What is generally now referred to as "the Citgo Gas Station" was in 2001 called "the Barracks K Gas Station".

Further west of the Navy Annex, there was a residential barracks for the armed services, and these two names seem to have become confused in his mind.
As Trooper Myrlin Wimbish states that he had driven up to the gas pumps, and saw the plane coing towards him from over the Navy Annex, we can be certain that he was at the Citgo station facing west, which is confirmed by the FOIA-released CCTV video footage from the station.

The YouTube channel cjnewson88 has the best version of the FOIA-released videos, and this is the 2 hour version of the CITGO CCTV.

Wimbish's black and white patrol car appears on the right of the upper right camera view, travelling right to left, at 04:08.
He pulls up on the north side of the gas pump where we see Sergeant William Lagasse's white car facing east towards the Pentagon, at 04:16.
We see the reflection from the rear of his car on the shiny canopy ceiling at this time.
At 04:28, we see the large white flash reflected on the ceiling, and in the next frame, Wimbish pulls out and drives off to the Pentagon.
In the obscured camera views at the lower edge of the screen, we see the station staff suddenly react to what they referred to as a loud nouise that shook the building, and run towards the door.
At 04:45, Sgt Lagasse starts to reverse out and head for the Pentagon.

More to come on the solar angles. Thought I had that info with me but not so.

Below is a map of the Pentagon area, the Citgo and Navy Annex locations, the disputed flightpaths, and alleged vs. actual locations of the taxi driver, Lloyde England, at the time the plane flew towards the Pentagon on 9-11-2001.

Here is a historical image of the former Citgo gas station from 2008, with the locations of some CCTV cameras, eyewitnesses and their cars marked on it.